Saturday 11th & Sunday 12th July 2015
Posted: Sat 11 Jul, 2015 7:43 am
Morning all.
And now they're going to use the same approach to child poverty - simply refuse to measure it.The chancellor, George Osborne, has refused to make any attempt to assess the overall impact on disabled people of his budget – and his next spending review – despite being urged to do so by the equality watchdog.
His refusal was confirmed by a senior civil servant just as Osborne was preparing to deliver a budget seen by many campaigners as another attack on disabled people’s living standards, in which he slashed future support for hundreds of thousands of people on out-of-work disability benefits.
A radical reform, proposed by Ed Miliband and trashed by the very same people who are applauding Osborne for it now. Presumably because Ed Miliband wanted to keep the tax credits until wages replaced them, not have a big income gap of several years where lots of people will fall through a hole and possibly lose their homes. And of course, Ed would have included everyone, so no pool of young people to be exploited either. It's all in the details, isn't it. If Ed had done this, it would have been really good for all workers on low wages and so the media think this would have been a truly terrible thing and thank goodness he didn't win the election. When Osborne implements the same policy, however, he manages to do it in such a way that a lot of people will actually be worse off, and, of course, this is wonderful and Osborne is very clever.Yet the more radical aspect of the new settlement is not the rate itself but the new link the chancellor has established between the minimum wage and median pay. Osborne has committed to a minimum wage (for the over 25s) worth 60 per cent of the median wage. This links the wages of the lowest paid adults in our economy to the wages of those in the middle. In an open and flexible labour market like the UK that is a radical institutional reform.
To be fair, Willow, they're not refusing to measure child poverty but changing it and there are valid arguments for doing so. However that does not excuse the fact that they shall use new measures to deceive. IDS and the DWP do come to mind on refusing to measure. I don't remember the detail but once IDS took over the department there was much that was no longer recorded ostensibly for efficiency savings.Willow904 wrote:With more cuts to income to come for disabled people, the government is still adamant it can't possibly assess whether all the changes overall leave disabled people with enough to live on:
http://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/os ... -benefits/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;And now they're going to use the same approach to child poverty - simply refuse to measure it.The chancellor, George Osborne, has refused to make any attempt to assess the overall impact on disabled people of his budget – and his next spending review – despite being urged to do so by the equality watchdog.
His refusal was confirmed by a senior civil servant just as Osborne was preparing to deliver a budget seen by many campaigners as another attack on disabled people’s living standards, in which he slashed future support for hundreds of thousands of people on out-of-work disability benefits.
Thick or not he does do some things successfully, frightful, even if I disapprove, using the Beeb like a Facebook account for example. I can barely wait for tomorrow's update.frightful_oik wrote:Why was the lefty BBC leading with an item about noble Dave standing up to cruel call-centres preying on vulnerable people on behalf of charities instead of his assault on workers' rights? The lead item was replete with quotes from our stern but statesmanlike leader promising action on this important issue. Well, yes, it is important, but not as important as something which will hit millions of families very hard. I've given up on the BBC.
There are valid reasons to add more measures of child poverty to get a more detailed picture I agree, but only one reason to remove the current measure completely - and that is so there are no like for like numbers by which to measure the impact on child poverty of current budget policies.utopiandreams wrote:To be fair, Willow, they're not refusing to measure child poverty but changing it and there are valid arguments for doing so. However that does not excuse the fact that they shall use new measures to deceive. IDS and the DWP do come to mind on refusing to measure. I don't remember the detail but once IDS took over the department there was much that was no longer recorded ostensibly for efficiency savings.Willow904 wrote:With more cuts to income to come for disabled people, the government is still adamant it can't possibly assess whether all the changes overall leave disabled people with enough to live on:
http://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/os ... -benefits/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;And now they're going to use the same approach to child poverty - simply refuse to measure it.The chancellor, George Osborne, has refused to make any attempt to assess the overall impact on disabled people of his budget – and his next spending review – despite being urged to do so by the equality watchdog.
His refusal was confirmed by a senior civil servant just as Osborne was preparing to deliver a budget seen by many campaigners as another attack on disabled people’s living standards, in which he slashed future support for hundreds of thousands of people on out-of-work disability benefits.
Well Messrs IDS, Cameron, Osborne et al with your meaningless qualifications when it comes to data and the like, I am/was a data specialist not that I need to be to make such simple observations during the information age. Hasn't anybody told you that there are advantages to real-time collection of data for later analysis whether you like the results or not. Apparently Theresa and the intelligence services keep hinting as much. 'And on that note Cameron, your internet trawling is detrimental to international trade. An Oxford First for our acting PM and Modern History for our Chancellor? Whatever their shrewd and clever games I cannot help feeling they're actually rather thick.
Edit: pluralised Mr. & corrected a spurious you're to your.
frightful_oik wrote:Why was the lefty BBC leading with an item about noble Dave standing up to cruel call-centres preying on vulnerable people on behalf of charities instead of his assault on workers' rights? The lead item was replete with quotes from our stern but statesmanlike leader promising action on this important issue. Well, yes, it is important, but not as important as something which will hit millions of families very hard. I've given up on the BBC.
Ashes for me.PorFavor wrote:Is it safe to assume that a lot of you are watching back-stabbing Serena Williams?
Ha! I was making those back stabbing comparisons in my mind as I watched PF. How dare she, how very dare she!PorFavor wrote:Is it safe to assume that a lot of you are watching back-stabbing Serena Williams?
From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?I was delighted to hear the Chancellor George Osborne confirm a compulsory Living Wage for all over 25s in this year’s budget.
Yeah - just to let her know that you know she's talking bollocks and she knows it.frightful_oik wrote:From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?I was delighted to hear the Chancellor George Osborne confirm a compulsory Living Wage for all over 25s in this year’s budget.
That's one of the reasons why I like Angela Eagle. She comes really very close to saying exactly that to her opponents. I think she's got a large dollop of street-fighter in her.rebeccariots2 wrote:Yeah - just to let her know that you know she's talking bollocks and she knows it.frightful_oik wrote:From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?I was delighted to hear the Chancellor George Osborne confirm a compulsory Living Wage for all over 25s in this year’s budget.
I think the Brian May style of politics is the way to go now - tell them when they are talking bollocks.
My condolences to Ken Clarke (should he happen to read here!)AnatolyKasparov wrote:The absence of Ken Clarke from the Tory benches during the budget was noted, and the fact he pulled out of a scheduled appearance at BBC's Question Time increased the speculation.
Turns out that it was not his own health at issue, though - his wife of over 50 years has just died. Commiserations.
Hiking with my husband.PorFavor wrote:Is it safe to assume that a lot of you are watching back-stabbing Serena Williams?
Paul Flynn @PaulFlynnMP 8m8 minutes ago Newport, Wales
Tory MP said in Commons that draghunting was 'like kisssing your sister' and no substitute for fox killing. i.e. the kill is the thrill.
Please someone tell me the USA media is full on denouncing the possibility that this man could be selected as a presidential candidate ... please.Stephen Mangan @StephenMangan 6h6 hours ago
You stay classy, Donald (via @giagia)
I so agree with this!rebeccariots2 wrote:Yeah - just to let her know that you know she's talking bollocks and she knows it.frightful_oik wrote:From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?I was delighted to hear the Chancellor George Osborne confirm a compulsory Living Wage for all over 25s in this year’s budget.
I think the Brian May style of politics is the way to go now - tell them when they are talking bollocks.
On the way back from the branch meeting this morning Mr Riots hit the nail on the head re Labour during and after the election - they've lost the ability to streetfight - pretty much everything is careful and defensive - that just won't work anymore (if it ever did).
Yes.rebeccariots2 wrote:Please someone tell me the USA media is full on denouncing the possibility that this man could be selected as a presidential candidate ... please.Stephen Mangan @StephenMangan 6h6 hours ago
You stay classy, Donald (via @giagia)
The USA wouldn't be that daft, would they?
Yes. Greece is 2% of the Eurozone, or something like that, but the EU couldn't deal with it.We see a European system of crisis management that is fraught with ineptitude, extreme politicization, gamesmanship, and unprofessionalism. I certainly do not mean to excuse Greek clientelism, corruption, and mismanagement as ultimate causes of the country’s predicament. Yet the failure of the European institutions is more alarming.
I've met her & heard her speak, Angela Eagle.PorFavor wrote:That's one of the reasons why I like Angela Eagle. She comes really very close to saying exactly that to her opponents. I think she's got a large dollop of street-fighter in her.rebeccariots2 wrote:Yeah - just to let her know that you know she's talking bollocks and she knows it.frightful_oik wrote: From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?
I think the Brian May style of politics is the way to go now - tell them when they are talking bollocks.
Doesn't offend me at all - there's all kinds of merit in what you're writing about.ScarletGas wrote:I so agree with this!rebeccariots2 wrote:Yeah - just to let her know that you know she's talking bollocks and she knows it.frightful_oik wrote: From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?
I think the Brian May style of politics is the way to go now - tell them when they are talking bollocks.
On the way back from the branch meeting this morning Mr Riots hit the nail on the head re Labour during and after the election - they've lost the ability to streetfight - pretty much everything is careful and defensive - that just won't work anymore (if it ever did).
What I do not understand about our current batch of Labour politicians (with some exceptions such as Angela Eagle & Stella Creasey amongst others) is this need to come over as all things to all men/women. This approach is always doomed to fail.They should be fully aware that the Tories play get down and dirty and the last election proved, if nothing else, you get nothing by being Mr nice guy/lady.
I was and am a great admirer of Ed Miliband and wish he was still leader. Osborne has proved in the budget that Labour under Miliband won the battle of ideas. His failing, in my opinion, was not to take on the people, who had proved many times that they would never give him a decent crack of the whip. The Tories, the Orange bookers, the written press and yes, even the BBC should have been viewed at the least as antagonists if not the enemy and should have been attacked in similar fashion when they attacked him. If that meant playing the man not the ball so be it because that was what they were doing to him.
Senior Labour politicians should in future discount any thought as to what the Daily Mail will say and be bold, honest about their own beliefs and try to get under the skin of those who attack them. No one should be under any illusions that BBC interviewers (La Kunnesburg,Humphries,Robinson,Stratton,Dimbleby etc.) see each interview as a battle of wills and a chance to further their own careers. Labour politicians should take them to task over snide or unwarranted comments and treat them to some of their own medicine.
This I accept may upset some voters (and even some here) but we should never underestimate the voter. They are crying out to see a Labour Party full of radical ideas, fight and prepared to yes, get down and dirty, fighting on their behalf not accepting their role is to be as sacrificial lambs. Once its understood the Tories don't play by the Queensbury rules then we are on the way to win in 2020.
Sorry for the rant but this has been bugging me for some time.................
This is so much a non-story that it amazes me that people still give it house space. Trump won't stand, for the very simple reason that he doesn't actually want to be President, and nobody would elect him anyway. I have as much realistic chance of being President and I'm not American, so I'm disqualified. It's all about publicity because everybody knows that he'd be so great a disaster in the job that Warren Harding would be redeemed.rebeccariots2 wrote:Please someone tell me the USA media is full on denouncing the possibility that this man could be selected as a presidential candidate ... please.Stephen Mangan @StephenMangan 6h6 hours ago
You stay classy, Donald (via @giagia)
The USA wouldn't be that daft, would they?
Yes.frightful_oik wrote:From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?I was delighted to hear the Chancellor George Osborne confirm a compulsory Living Wage for all over 25s in this year’s budget.
“Today’s Budget confirms what the Prime Minister said after the General Election, that we would be a government for all in Britain, for One Nation. The Chancellor confirmed and delivered our manifesto promise to increase the National Minimum Wage incrementally to £9 by 2020, and that starting in April 2016 it will stand at £7.20 an hour.
Introducing the Living Wage is absolutely the right thing to do. We have gone further for people on lower incomes that also have the assurance of the Chancellor that the Personal Tax Allowance will always increase along with the Minimum Wage.
Furthermore with the increase in the amount you can earn, before you pay Income Tax, will rise from £10,600 to £11,000. This will save the average taxpayer an extra £80 a year, which means average earners, will be paying £905 less in tax than when I was first elected in 2010.
http://www.southderbyshireconservatives ... t-thing-do" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
That's good to see. I have found myself wondering if Ken Clarke has children - and hoping he has so he has others around with shared experiences and memories of her and take them forward. 50 years is a long partnership.Chris Bryant MP @RhonddaBryant 1h1 hour ago
Really sad to hear that Ken Clarke has lost his wife Gillian. A really lovely and very funny lady.
My MP too, гражданка, she's just a Tory mouthpiece. I only recently found out that she used to be on the council so have asked others about her. Not one of them had a good word to say of her. Whether that reflects more on me is open to question.citizenJA wrote:Yes.frightful_oik wrote:From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?I was delighted to hear the Chancellor George Osborne confirm a compulsory Living Wage for all over 25s in this year’s budget.
Make sure that quote came out of your Tory MPs mouth.
Don't get me wrong, I know the Tories are appropriating 'the living wage' as though what they're offering is the living wage when it's not the living wage as confirmed by the Living Wage Foundation.
I found this linked below:“Today’s Budget confirms what the Prime Minister said after the General Election, that we would be a government for all in Britain, for One Nation. The Chancellor confirmed and delivered our manifesto promise to increase the National Minimum Wage incrementally to £9 by 2020, and that starting in April 2016 it will stand at £7.20 an hour.
Introducing the Living Wage is absolutely the right thing to do. We have gone further for people on lower incomes that also have the assurance of the Chancellor that the Personal Tax Allowance will always increase along with the Minimum Wage.
Furthermore with the increase in the amount you can earn, before you pay Income Tax, will rise from £10,600 to £11,000. This will save the average taxpayer an extra £80 a year, which means average earners, will be paying £905 less in tax than when I was first elected in 2010.
http://www.southderbyshireconservatives ... t-thing-do" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Poundland Donald Trump? Enjoy. (As the nervous celebrity masterchef contestants inevitably say with a mix of desperation and hope after placing their offerings in front of the critic diners ... and it irritates me every time).Page 3 girls and UKIP donations: Inside the mind of Liverpool’s Lyceum owner
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liv ... ns-9628924" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There is an issue with some left(ish)-wing activists in the US making up quotes and chucking them out on twitter. For all his insanity, I would say that this is not a Trump quote.rebeccariots2 wrote:Please someone tell me the USA media is full on denouncing the possibility that this man could be selected as a presidential candidate ... please.Stephen Mangan @StephenMangan 6h6 hours ago
You stay classy, Donald (via @giagia)
The USA wouldn't be that daft, would they?
I do hope you are right.refitman wrote:There is an issue with some left(ish)-wing activists in the US making up quotes and chucking them out on twitter. For all his insanity, I would say that this is not a Trump quote.rebeccariots2 wrote:Please someone tell me the USA media is full on denouncing the possibility that this man could be selected as a presidential candidate ... please.Stephen Mangan @StephenMangan 6h6 hours ago
You stay classy, Donald (via @giagia)
The USA wouldn't be that daft, would they?
Kevin Maguire @Kevin_Maguire 8m8 minutes ago
Mr T Driver, Rosa Luxemburg & Antonio Gramsci booked then cancelled late at anti-tube strike posh London restaurant! http://www.morningstaronline.co.uk/a-bf ... ti-strike-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Budget 2015: Women who have been raped may have to prove assault for third child tax credits
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 82434.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
'Normal' - the latest separatist term - possibly the most chilling yet - to sit alongside 'hard working' and 'ordinary'.CARTIMANDUA 6 hours ago
Then they should have had an abortion. That is what normal people would do if pregnant by a rape.
I agree with you wholeheartedly, @ScarletGas. It could not hurt to challenge Tories on panels who crow (or interviewers who do the same,) "But you planned to do the same – we'd think you should be pleased." with, "You have taken carefully thought out and costed plans from our manifesto but added particularly cruel twists to them so that they can no longer do the good they would have done under a Labour Government." They have to be taken to task over perpetrating a fraud by calling an increased over-25s' National Minimum Wage a 'Living Wage' when it is nothing of the sort.ScarletGas wrote:I so agree with this!rebeccariots2 wrote:Yeah - just to let her know that you know she's talking bollocks and she knows it.frightful_oik wrote: From my Tory MP. Question is, is there any point in my writing to put her right?
I think the Brian May style of politics is the way to go now - tell them when they are talking bollocks.
On the way back from the branch meeting this morning Mr Riots hit the nail on the head re Labour during and after the election - they've lost the ability to streetfight - pretty much everything is careful and defensive - that just won't work anymore (if it ever did).
What I do not understand about our current batch of Labour politicians (with some exceptions such as Angela Eagle & Stella Creasey amongst others) is this need to come over as all things to all men/women. This approach is always doomed to fail.They should be fully aware that the Tories play get down and dirty and the last election proved, if nothing else, you get nothing by being Mr nice guy/lady.
I was and am a great admirer of Ed Miliband and wish he was still leader. Osborne has proved in the budget that Labour under Miliband won the battle of ideas. His failing, in my opinion, was not to take on the people, who had proved many times that they would never give him a decent crack of the whip. The Tories, the Orange bookers, the written press and yes, even the BBC should have been viewed at the least as antagonists if not the enemy and should have been attacked in similar fashion when they attacked him. If that meant playing the man not the ball so be it because that was what they were doing to him.
Senior Labour politicians should in future discount any thought as to what the Daily Mail will say and be bold, honest about their own beliefs and try to get under the skin of those who attack them. No one should be under any illusions that BBC interviewers (La Kunnesburg,Humphries,Robinson,Stratton,Dimbleby etc.) see each interview as a battle of wills and a chance to further their own careers. Labour politicians should take them to task over snide or unwarranted comments and treat them to some of their own medicine.
This I accept may upset some voters (and even some here) but we should never underestimate the voter. They are crying out to see a Labour Party full of radical ideas, fight and prepared to yes, get down and dirty, fighting on their behalf not accepting their role is to be as sacrificial lambs. Once its understood the Tories don't play by the Queensbury rules then we are on the way to win in 2020.
Sorry for the rant but this has been bugging me for some time.................
When you read opinions like that from CARTIMANDUA, you start to consider seriously a culling of the population.rebeccariots2 wrote:Some of the comments BTL on this find a new low ...
Budget 2015: Women who have been raped may have to prove assault for third child tax credits
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 82434.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;'Normal' - the latest separatist term - possibly the most chilling yet - to sit alongside 'hard working' and 'ordinary'.CARTIMANDUA 6 hours ago
Then they should have had an abortion. That is what normal people would do if pregnant by a rape.