Christmas Bank Holiday Weekend: 26, 27 & 28th December

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:13 pm

TobyLatimer wrote:There was an aerial shot of a sewerage processing plant in Manchester that looked vulnerable and nearly underwater , if that were to start leaking there would be havoc.

Yes, and the following report from the linked EA website indicates the 'firestation, the treatment works' are at risk from the breaching riverbank.

River Irwell at Ramsbottom
Flood Warning
Flood status last changed at 11:40 on 26 Dec 2015

Location:
River bank overtopping is expected. Areas at risk include the firestation, the treatment works, Great Eaves Rd and Athol street.
Other areas at risk include Garden Street, Kenyon St, Nuttall Park and Ramsbottom Football and Cricket grounds

http://apps.environment-agency.gov.uk/f ... ramsbottom" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(my bold)

"Stuart Humphreys filmed the River Irwell breaking its banks near the Lowry Hotel...
The River Irwell and River Roch have both overflowed, causing flooding in Salford..."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35181139" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

How's 'the firestation and treatment works...', then? Anyone know?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:18 pm

The stories on the Internet don't all have the same information - no conspiracy, events change fast, areas are cut off with roads under water.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:20 pm

Environment Secretary Elizabeth Truss said:

Over the past 24 hours we have seen very high levels of rainfall on already saturated ground in Yorkshire and Lancashire. This has resulted in rivers rising to historically high levels and severe flood warnings being issued.

I chaired COBR meetings on Christmas Day and this morning to ensure that the best possible preparations were made and that local authorities, emergency services, the Environment Agency and the armed forces were working together to respond.

Late on Christmas Day it became clear that the majority of the rain was likely to fall in Lancashire and Yorkshire.

Therefore the Environment Agency and the army worked through Christmas evening and overnight to move temporary defences, pumps and personnel to those areas.

In both Lancashire and Yorkshire, emergency services and armed forces personnel from 2nd Battalion Duke of Lancaster’s Regiment (2LANCS) have been working round the clock to warn, inform, to protect lives and properties and to evacuate vulnerable communities.

This work continues as we expect further impacts tonight and into tomorrow and beyond.

This is clearly a particularly terrible time of year for flooding to take place and families and business to suffer. I have every sympathy for their situation and I am determined to ensure that affected communities get all the support they need.

I am travelling to affected areas tonight with the Cabinet Office Minister, Oliver Letwin and Chief Executive of the Environment Agency, Sir James Bevan, to ensure that those working on the ground have all they need. A further COBR will be held tomorrow morning.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:23 pm

Flood Warnings
19:07 on 26 Dec 2015
This information is updated every 15 minutes
28 for Severity = Severe Flood Warning

http://apps.environment-agency.gov.uk/f ... ity&term=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The EA has issued 28 of the highest severity - danger to life

Location:
Areas to the east of St Nicholas fields between Melrosegate and Tang Hall Lane along Osbaldwick Beck to Osbaldwick Village

This Severe Flood Warning has been issued for the River Foss due to rising river levels. Because of water entering the
Foss Barrier building the pumps are in danger of failing due to electrical failure. The decision has been taken to lift the
Foss Barrier as if it fails in the down position water will be unable to discharge into the River Ouse. The immediate area
at risk is the city centre and areas of Huntington, Tang Hall, Osbaldwick and Foss Islands. People in these areas should
start to move valuables to upper floors and be prepared to be evacuated. Please listen to media, local radio for updates
and any instructions issued by emergency services. Our Flood Incident room is open and we are watching this situation
closely. We will update this message as new information comes available.

19:06 on 26 Dec 2015

http://apps.environment-agency.gov.uk/f ... ity&term=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

good lord

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:31 pm

Mary Creagh ‏@MaryCreaghMP 16m16 minutes ago
Flood defence spending cut by 27% in 2010-graph.The rollercoaster path of government spending on flood defence. http://touchstoneblog.org.uk/2015/12/th ... -on-flood-" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The blog piece points out the dreadful false economy of the cuts in flood defence spending (not to mention other vital services). There will now have to be a massive spend to repair essential infrastructure - roads, bridges, drains etc etc - along with repairing the damage to properties.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:32 pm

And as I said meanwhile here in the hills this is about to start

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:33 pm

Flood warnings for:
England and Wales
7:31pm Saturday 26 December 2015

There are currently 28 severe flood warnings, 233 warnings and 144 alerts in force at this location.
28 Severe flood warnings - severe flooding. Danger to life.
▼ 28 Severe flood warnings - severe flooding. Danger to life.

https://flood-warning-information.servi ... severity-1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

AngryAsWell · Post by **AngryAsWell** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:37 pm

citizenJA wrote:
The EA said 85% of the country's temporary flood barriers had been sent to Cumbria, where
rainfall has smashed records...The Environment Agency is reporting rivers in Lancashire at
their highest recorded levels.

Waters have peaked in Whalley and are expected to do so in Ribchester at 6.15pm
....the Met Office is forecasting 'a further spell of heavy rain' this evening.

http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/ne ... ng_issued/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Reports of an explosion in Bury - River Irwell bursting its banks
We've family in Bury
ErnstRemarx, my love to you and family

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... r-10652325" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ernst was in Tottington when last heard from, Tott's had some flooding but not quite as bad (at last count, tho may have changed by now) as Radcliffe or other local flooded areas like Summerseat
Pub washed away in Summerseat on River Irwell

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35183448" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Have been there many times, was a lovely restaurant, can't see it being rebuilt.
Glad to read the better health news over last couple of weeks.
Fingers crossed for a better 2016 than 2015 for all.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:49 pm

Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 1h1 hour ago
Nigel Farage joins crowd at Boxing Day hunt as debate rages over ban http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ni ... ng-7074989" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

One of his populist policies?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:57 pm

News Story
Update on flooding - Saturday 26 December evening
Elizabeth Truss MP
Oliver Letwin MP
26 December 2015

"This is clearly a particularly terrible time of year for flooding to take place and families and business to suffer.
I have every sympathy for their situation and I am determined to ensure that affected communities get all the
support they need."

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/upda ... er-evening" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is there a better time of year for families and businesses to have this flooding take place?
Sympathy don't fill the sand bags.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 7:59 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 1h1 hour ago
Nigel Farage joins crowd at Boxing Day hunt as debate rages over ban http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ni ... ng-7074989" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …
One of his populist policies?

Was this crowd he joined on horses and wearing red coats?

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:02 pm

citizenJA wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:
Mirror Politics ‏@MirrorPolitics 1h1 hour ago
Nigel Farage joins crowd at Boxing Day hunt as debate rages over ban http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ni ... ng-7074989" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …
One of his populist policies?
Was this crowd he joined on horses and wearing red coats?

It was the crowd drinking around and cheering on the people on horses and wearing red coats that he joined. He is a hunt supporter.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:03 pm

Benjamin Myers
‏@BenMyers1
Just spent an hour chest deep in icy flood water in Mytholmroyd, evacuating OAPs from their flats. No authorities here. Terrible scenes.

Sharon Holroyd ‏@orthotistmk 4h4 hours ago
@BenMyers1 do you know where people in mytholmroyd are being evacuated to? concerned about my grandma being evacuated from downstairs flat
Benjamin Myers ‏@BenMyers1 4h4 hours ago
@orthotistmk I'm not sure Sharon. Where does she live?

Sharon Holroyd ‏@orthotistmk 4h4 hours ago
@BenMyers1 she lives in elphaborough close

Benjamin Myers ‏@BenMyers1 4h4 hours ago
@orthotistmk Most ground floor flats are flooded out there unfortunately. What is she called?

Sharon Holroyd ‏@orthotistmk 4h4 hours ago
@BenMyers1 we'll check the river status tomorrow morning and bring dry clothes etc and try to find her! Stay safe and thank you so much!

Benjamin Myers ‏@BenMyers1 3h3 hours ago
@orthotistmk Good luck. Its a mess here - just tried to get back to your Gran's flats, but couldn't. Then I fell over in the mud...

Sharon Holroyd ‏@orthotistmk 3h3 hours ago
@BenMyers1 thank you.....that's so incredibly kind of you to try....So sorry you fell, hope you are not hurt. X

Benjamin Myers ‏@BenMyers1 3h3 hours ago
@orthotistmk Its ok, I was down there dog-walking anyway when you messaged me. Power cuts now too.

Joanne Harris ‏@Joannechocolat 2h2 hours ago
@BenMyers1 Bloody hell. Take care...

Max Dunbar ‏@MaxDunbar1 7h7 hours ago
@BenMyers1 You're a brave man and kind. Stay safe

Sarah Perry ‏@SarahGPerry 7h7 hours ago
@BenMyers1 For all the good sympathy can do (nothing, I know) I am appalled and so so sad about this.
0 retweets 4 likes

ensive riot julbock ‏@thespyglass 7h7 hours ago
@BenMyers1 Shit. Great work, and of course you do it for people if you can, but horrible it's been left to all of you who live there.

Ian McLoughlin ॐ ‏@IanMcL13 2h2 hours ago
@BenMyers1 Can only echo people's words of thanks to you - be safe

Kate Hodges ‏@TheeKateHodges 3h3 hours ago
@BenMyers1 Bloody hell. Good work, Ben. Hope you're OK, and everyone is safe and warm now.

Susan Burns ‏@hebdenblog 6h6 hours ago
@BenMyers1 well done Ben - it's unbelievable

Kelvin Owers ‏@spittingcat 6h6 hours ago
@BenMyers1 Well done.

Rob St.John ‏@robsaintjohn 6h6 hours ago
@BenMyers1 you're a top man. We're two flooded towns away else we'd be there to help.

Amy Liptrot ‏@amy_may 7h7 hours ago
@BenMyers1 bloody hell. Well done for helping Ben.

E ‏@VexSlain 7h7 hours ago
@BenMyers1 Fucking hell, where is everyone?!

Lesley Wilkinson ‏@janelesley 54m54 minutes ago
@BenMyers1 @Joannechocolat Terrible scenes across the region. We've experienced this in the past - please take care. We hope help comes soon

TobyLatimer · Post by **TobyLatimer** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:21 pm

: ScreenShot01346.jpg (51.68 KiB) Viewed 7024 times

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:28 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:
citizenJA wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote: One of his populist policies?
Was this crowd he joined on horses and wearing red coats?
It was the crowd drinking around and cheering on the people on horses and wearing red coats that he joined. He is a hunt supporter.

Thought so.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:32 pm

31 severest warnings now, up from 28 a half hour ago

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:32 pm

TobyLatimer wrote:
ScreenShot01346.jpg

Dear Lord...Is anyone actually in charge?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:42 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
TobyLatimer wrote:
ScreenShot01346.jpg
Dear Lord...Is anyone actually in charge?

I know.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:51 pm

citizenJA wrote:
ohsocynical wrote:
TobyLatimer wrote:
ScreenShot01346.jpg
Dear Lord...Is anyone actually in charge?
I know.

Cameron is hosting a Cobra 'call' tomorrow. So he thinks he's in charge. Scary.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 8:54 pm

This has just been sent to me ... would appreciate folks signing and sharing. Let's counteract their moves to 'relax' the Hunting Ban with a resounding call to strengthen it.

Strengthen the 2004 Hunting Act - Petitions

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105997" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 9:45 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:This has just been sent to me ... would appreciate folks signing and sharing. Let's counteract their moves to 'relax' the Hunting Ban with a resounding call to strengthen it.

Strengthen the 2004 Hunting Act - Petitions

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105997" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Done.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:00 pm

Professor John Howson has been doing more good work on teacher recruitment. There are problems coming in London.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015 ... -graduates" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This would be very significant, because London is the most highly funded area. Osborne has promised a more equal funding settlement for other regions, and there's a good case for that. Without extra money though it can only be done by taking away money from London.

In the past I was fairly sanguine about London cuts, and thought that its funding wasn't needed now that the schools had been turned around. But if it turns out that all the money (and more) is needed to recruit teachers in London, that makes it all more difficult.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:10 pm

Autumn statement had 30% cuts for the Environment Agency.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:21 pm

Sir Lynton Crosby.

Yuk. Double yuk.

PorFavor · Post by **PorFavor** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:23 pm

rebeccariots2 wrote:This has just been sent to me ... would appreciate folks signing and sharing. Let's counteract their moves to 'relax' the Hunting Ban with a resounding call to strengthen it.

Strengthen the 2004 Hunting Act - Petitions

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105997" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Done.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:38 pm

Alan Matthews
‏@hazmatt72 Alan Matthews Retweeted Sky News

*Sir* Lynton Crosby? I think I just threw up in my mouth a little.

Me too.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:53 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:Autumn statement had 30% cuts for the Environment Agency.

I weary of repeating Orwellian Orwellian doubleplus ungood doubleplus ungood I'm not a very original thinker at all am I by repeating Orwellian Orwellian quotes but then that was the whole reason for implementing the Tory Orwellian Austerity Forever regime wasn't it to make everyone repeat the same things over and over and over...

Efficiency and Reform
Through its ambitious efficiencies programme, Defra will become a more streamlined, digital department, sharing back office functions like IT, human resources and finance with its network bodies to reduce unnecessary bureaucracy, and devolving roles to the local frontline to ensure effective service delivery. Through this programme, Defra will reduce its administration budgets by 26% by 2019‑20, saving £123 million.

Defra will continue to reduce costly bureaucracy and red tape, securing net savings to business of £470 million by the end of the Parliament. As part of this, Defra will set up a Single Farm Inspection Taskforce to reduce the burden on farmers, aiming to cut farm inspections by 20,000 by 2019-20.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/decc ... eview-2015" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This government would be hilarious as a television program or film or cartoon or book but they're not - they're real.

Security
The government will continue to prioritise investment in flood defences. The government’s £2.3 billion capital programme will invest in over 1,500 schemes to give 300,000 homes greater security from flooding by 2021. Flood defence maintenance funding will also be protected, and Defra will work with the Environment Agency to generate 10% efficiencies by 2019-20 with all savings reinvested to better protect another 4,000 homes.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the- ... eview-2015" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The hell you will though - it's like living with someone insisting night is day while starving you at the same time. Did I write, 'it's like'? We are living with government insisting night is day while causing starvation. The foodbanks flooded. So did markets. We're all in this together.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:55 pm

PorFavor wrote:
rebeccariots2 wrote:This has just been sent to me ... would appreciate folks signing and sharing. Let's counteract their moves to 'relax' the Hunting Ban with a resounding call to strengthen it.

Strengthen the 2004 Hunting Act - Petitions

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105997" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Done.

Done.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 10:59 pm

So DEFRA can save all that money because technology. What are they using now? Punch cards?

The Department for Transport also have 30% running cost cuts. Given that they went something like £2.5bn over budget before, I wouldn't be optimistic.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 11:02 pm

With no opposition, the Tories are free to do what they like
While Iain Duncan Smith is still in office, compassion will be no part of the Conservative canon
- by Nick Cohen

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... -strangers" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If you keep up that cognitive dissonance, Nick, one day you'll not know when the sun is shining without Tory government telling you.

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 11:04 pm

Anyone heard from Sir Philip Dilley?

He's the Chair of the Environment Agency. No idea whether he's any good or not, but I do recall his predecessor, Chris Smith, getting lots of rubbish chucked at him when there were floods.

Dilley is an engineer by trade, so would be nice if he had more flood defences to oversee.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 11:13 pm

Tubby Isaacs wrote:So DEFRA can save all that money because technology. What are they using now? Punch cards?

The Department for Transport also have 30% running cost cuts. Given that they went something like £2.5bn over budget before, I wouldn't be optimistic.

I'm not optimistic, Tubby Isaacs, but I thank you for reminding me we've still documentation of Chancellor Jeff's budget-speak confirming they're more ridiculous and inadequate with each passing day.

I burst out into tears the morning of 8 May 2015 when I learned Tory government were returned to Parliament. I knew what Tory government would do. I've no problem being wrong. I'd willingly be laughed at for the rest of my life for being wrong about Tory government if it turns out I am. I'll laugh with genuine joy at my being wrong about the worthlessness of Tory government.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 11:29 pm

River Aire at Cardigan Fields Leisure Park and Kirkstall Works between Viaduct Road and City Gate
23:07 on 26 Dec 2015
Severe Flood Warning

Leeds including Cardigan Fields Leisure Park including Evanston Avenue and Cardigan Fields Road.
Airedale Chemical Works off Kirkstall Road, including Washington Street and Aire Place.

Flooding is causing and expected to cause further impacts in central Leeds Area. This Severe Flood
Warning has been issued because of significant impacts to infrastructure and risk to life in the area.
We have experienced record levels in the Aire Catchment. The peak at Armley is expected around
23:00 tonight. This is the highest ever record and higher than in 2007. We are working with police
and other partners to maintain public safety. We are also supporting the coordinated multi-agency
response. We are closely monitoring the situation from the Leeds Incident Room which is open.

This message will be updated if the situation changes. River levels at Armley can be viewed
on our website https://flood-warning-information.servi ... ation/8009" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://apps.environment-agency.gov.uk/f ... ity&term=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 11:55 pm

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015 ... rgency-nhs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A&Es hit by children's mental health crisis
Troubled children add to NHS burden as concern grows over lack of out-of-hours care

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sat 26 Dec, 2015 11:59 pm

Government accused of launching 'attack on local democracy' with new council investment rule

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 86916.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 12:18 am

What did Dave do today? Was he hunting?

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 12:38 am

goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 5:54 am

https://www.theccc.org.uk/publication/p ... t-spending

Analysis of whether enough was being spent on flood defences, have only quoted conclusion but whole document is interesting.

The current ratio implies that each £1 taken from the programme means expected future flood damages will be £8 higher than otherwise. Value for money will be less strong amongst schemes on the margin, perhaps achieving £6 in benefits per £1 spent. But even at this more modest rate of return we can expect an extra £3 billion in avoidable flood damages in future years because spending this period is half a billion pounds behind the identified need.

Edited to add:-
I realise government are/will be saying that present flooding/rain levels are unprecedented/unpredicted,
but I was interested in how the current spending levels match what the accepted need was.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 6:15 am

Calls for Labour to split are indulgent when the priority is to engage voters
Marc Stears

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... wer-labour" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinybgoat · Post by **tinybgoat** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 7:19 am

http://www.farmingfutures.org.uk/blog/f ... d%E2%80%99

The recent ‘unprecedented’ flooding in north-west England might be more common than currently believed, a group of scientists has warned.

A team of experts from the Universities of Aberystwyth, Cambridge and Glasgow have drawn on historic records to build a clearer picture of the flooding. They conclude that 21st-century flood events such as Storm Desmond are not exceptional or unprecedented in terms of their frequency or magnitude, and that flood frequency and flood risk forecasts would be improved by including data from flood deposits dating back hundreds of years.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 8:09 am

FWIW Governments,especially this Government predicate policy,especially in the area of social security,on propagandising the view that risk-sickness/disability unexpected caring responsibities/job loss etc are lifestyle choices and tough shit if long term ie.you must be encouraged to make the same choices as the designated fabricated betters.Interesting compare and contrast with their systematic irresponsibility

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 8:24 am

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 85591.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Theresa May wants to see your internet history, so we thought it was only fair to ask for hers
The Home Office is keeping Ms May's list of visited websites a secret

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 9:02 am

Another attack on local democracy.

The DCLG is to stop councils from mounting their own boycott/sanction campaigns - the councils will lose their right to refuse to trade with or invest in companies or countries which they do not approve of (eg. boycotts of Israeli goods, pension funds investments in arms or tobacco companies).

According to the DCLG, councils' procurement and investment policies "must be consistent with UK government foreign policy".

So much for localism. Obviously, we can only have localism if it is in complete agreement with Westminster, irrespective of what we voted for.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 9:26 am

ephemerid wrote:Another attack on local democracy.

The DCLG is to stop councils from mounting their own boycott/sanction campaigns - the councils will lose their right to refuse to trade with or invest in companies or countries which they do not approve of (eg. boycotts of Israeli goods, pension funds investments in arms or tobacco companies).

According to the DCLG, councils' procurement and investment policies "must be consistent with UK government foreign policy".

So much for localism. Obviously, we can only have localism if it is in complete agreement with Westminster, irrespective of what we voted for.

So I wonder if they are going to extend that loss of autonomy / local democracy to such things as councils voting to not have badger killing on their land? Such a policy completely stinks.

And what a nonsense this will make of any Northern Powerhouse - or Green City such as Bristol wanting to do their own thing.

Morning.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 9:31 am

You have to wonder about the intelligence of the person who said this...and the tweeter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spencer_L ... _Livermore" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Spencer Livermore, Baron Livermore (born 12 June 1975, Slough, Berkshire) is a British Labour Party strategy and communications professional. On 21 October 2015 he was created a life peer, taking the title Baron Livermore, of Rotherhithe in the London Borough of Southwark.[1]

He served as an adviser to the New Labour government from 1997 to 2008, as Director of Strategy to the Prime Minister in 10 Downing Street and as Chief Strategy Adviser to the Chancellor of the Exchequer in the Treasury.

He also served as a senior adviser on four General Election campaigns: 1997, 2001, 2005, and 2015, with the Guardian describing him as one of the most experienced election campaigners in the Labour Party.[2] Philip Gould described him in The Unfinished Revolution as one of seven people who devised the strategy for the election-winning 2001 and 2005 general election campaigns.

So, having worked in government and not simply for the party, it's nothing like Crosby at all then. A better comparison to Livermore is James O'Shaughnessy who was Cameron's director of policy in 2011/11

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 9:33 am

Jamila Hanan
‏@JamilaHanan
My sis went to take cups tea to firemen in #UKfloods They said they'd 30 working flat out,but cut backs will mean only 10 firemen next year.

rebeccariots2 · Post by **rebeccariots2** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 9:56 am

Jeremy Corbyn to dismiss 'disloyal' shadow ministers in New Year reshuffle
Hilary Benn and Maria Eagle are among party heavyweights facing demotion in the first week of January
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 86956.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not sure how I feel about this - if it turns out to be the case. Will add fuel to those wanting to publicly vent dissatisfaction with Corbyn - but I also realise that it's probably what any other leader deemed to be showing 'leadership' in the more habitual example of that term would do. The argument for demoting them given here is that if MPs such as Benn want to argue against Corbyn's approach they should be doing that from the backbenches and not the despatch box. Angela Eagle is said to have annoyed by refusing on TV to back Corbyn as leader when going into the election in 2020 ... didn't hear her so I can't comment on whether that's actually the case or not. Would be a shame to lose someone with her experience and nous. (The headline says Maria Eagle ... not sure what she's done ... the article mostly refers to Angela ... but I also rate Maria Eagle).

Was hoping we'd have at least a few weeks away from talks of splits and dissension and mud slinging. Would have liked Labour to be in the news for the right reasons over the holidays.

ephemerid · Post by **ephemerid** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 10:02 am

HindleA wrote:FWIW Governments,especially this Government predicate policy,especially in the area of social security,on propagandising the view that risk-sickness/disability unexpected caring responsibities/job loss etc are lifestyle choices and tough shit if long term ie.you must be encouraged to make the same choices as the designated fabricated betters.Interesting compare and contrast with their systematic irresponsibility

Governments used to have a legal and moral duty to ensure that no UK citizen was left destitute.
The coalition government passed legislation to remove that duty.
This government will implement it to the max.

Yes, they use propaganda to garner support for their policies; and it works.....but only for so long.
The woman on QT may have been the first really public example of how the sheeple thought none of this vicious mendacious propaganda was directed at them - but there will be many more as 2016 unfolds, and they will be angry.

In December 2014, 37,753 people claiming JSA and 3,274 people claiming ESA were sanctioned for a minimum of 4 weeks.
That's 40,000 people - in just one month.
I wonder how many it will be for this December. Less, because the claimant count has fallen? More, because there is an increase in the number of ill people being sanctioned?

Dr.David Webster of the University of Glasgow provides CPAG with analysis of DWP statistics. He has noted that sanctions for JSA claimants have fallen in the same proportions as the claimant count - but he also notes that there are no official figures for sanctions on Universal Credit claimants. Sanctions imposed on ESA claimants are rising, especially people who have mental health problems and those who have already had a sanction.

Dr.Webster has also looked at the rate of appeals and hardship payments. People do appeal against sanctions, but not in large numbers; the low rate of challenge means that just 14% of JSA and 20% of ESA sanctions are overturned on mandatory reconsideraton or appeal.
Before the new sanctions regime was introduced in 2012, hardship payments (what was then the Crisis Loan system, now abolished) were issued to 10% of all sanctioned claimants. Last year, it was 40% - and as Dr.Webster says, "Since people only get a payment f they are completely cleaned out of resources, this indicates a massive scale of destitution".

Destitution. That is what our social security system has become - a vehicle for government to impose destitution on the people it has a moral duty to protect and support using the money we give it for that purpose. Instead, they use our money for their own agenda - whether that's war, privatisations, lining their pockets, whatever.

This is not irresponsibility, dear HindleA - it is evil. These people know exactly what they are doing. The propaganda is there to deflect the people from what is really going on here, and this bunch of vicious ideologues will not stop until they are forced to.

I hope that 2016 is the year it happens - and if it doesn't, more people are going to die destitute as so many have already.

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 10:23 am

Morning All

Thankfully it's finally stopped raining and it's a clear, calm weather day here in the Pennines. The overnight rain wasn't as bad as it might have been and the level of our river has certainly dropped.

I'm really surprised that it's already after 10 and there seems to be no government statement on the extent of the damage from yesterday's floods, on the travel situation etc. Or am I surprised? After all it's mainly Greater Manchester and West Yorkshire that have been affected and there only 5 million people there

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Sun 27 Dec, 2015 10:23 am

Agree,irresponsible in the generality of governance,evil in the deliberate targeting.Fascistic intent,surely clear to all but the wilfully blind;worse,cheered on.