Tuesday 5th July 2016

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:11 pm

Ken Clarke telling it like it is.

Willow904 · Post by **Willow904** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:12 pm

RobertSnozers wrote:'Twas Brexit, and the slithy Goves
Did gripe and grumble in the Mail
All Menschy were the Boris droves
And Nigel Farage is a fascist

Courtesy of Simon Pegg

I like Simon Pegg.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:23 pm

Feel very encouraged about my fellow humans this afternoon.

At the doctor's surgery an Eastern European woman was in the waiting room.
She had two lovely little boys, very cute and although lively they were beautifully well mannered.
She chatted away to them in a lovely tone of voice in her own language.
Not sure where she was from.
She dropped her pram over and myself and several others rushed to help. Two gents got up and helped her get the pram through the door when her appointment was called. The older boy had a hand crayoned Welsh flag, must have been made at infants school, and proudly waved it.
People waiting for their appointments joined in the merriment caused by the boys play and chatter in their mum's language.

I just felt so embarrassed. I wanted her to know that we didn't all vote Leave because we don't like EU immigrants.

Later she was in the chemist when I went to get my script. We had a chat, not easy because her English wasn't good, but you can communicate with smiles and gestures.
The older boy got excited to see a large Welsh flag in the window [everywhere is emblazoned since the Wales footie success] and spoke excitedly to his mum, and she said something in broken English about Wales to him in an encouraging tone. A little boy who will be brought up to feel affection for his family origins and respect and affection for Wales too.

Very encouraging, and a reminder not everyone resents foreigners.

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:24 pm

Almost missed in everything else that is going on - Naz Shah MP has been readmitted to the Labour party and PLP.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:31 pm

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh · 1d1 day ago
After Kinnock speech, I'm told that is the first time ever there was a standing ovation at PLP.

Carl Dinnen ‏@carldinnen · 7h7 hours ago
@LabourEoin @paulwaugh This referred to a PLP in December!

Maeght · Post by **Maeght** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:34 pm

From Kevin Maguire on twitter:

Kevin Maguire ‏@Kevin_Maguire 3h3 hours ago
Just bumped into Jeremy Corbyn and he was very smiley and cheery for a man under pressure. Didn't see him carrying a towel to throw in

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:37 pm

ohsocynical wrote:Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh · 1d1 day ago
After Kinnock speech, I'm told that is the first time ever there was a standing ovation at PLP.

Carl Dinnen ‏@carldinnen · 7h7 hours ago
@LabourEoin @paulwaugh This referred to a PLP in December!

Its fair to say that Waugh is not having a good, erm, war

He is hardly alone there, mind......

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:44 pm

How does 'CleggWasRight' not get his/her account deleted on Cif ?

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:51 pm

Minister for Brexit defends the Government doing absolutely no contingency planning for Brexit
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 21126.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

democracy
even the party I'm a member of can't offer me a single leader I'd want to vote for
or very many policies

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 5:53 pm

Was Andrea Leadsom really such a City hotshot?

Andrea Leadsom has made much of her “25 years in Financial services” before the she became an MP. She is being widely described as “a banker”. Last week Bernard Jenkin MP endorsed her, citing her senior position at “a large investment firm where she was responsible for managing hundreds of people and billions of pounds”. In her interview with the BBC’s Andrew Marr on Sunday, she claimed during those 25 years to have “run enormous teams, small teams, start-up businesses”.

The problem about these claims is that they risk misleading people into believing that she has finance management skills and experience which qualify her for senior posts in government.

http://reaction.life/was-andrea-leadsom ... y-hotshot/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:18 pm

: CmncO0TWAAUiHbn.jpg (67.4 KiB) Viewed 6658 times

mbc1955 · Post by **mbc1955** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:28 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
CmncO0TWAAUiHbn.jpg

I dunno about the rest but the protest blank ballots were a waste of everybody's time, especially the 'protesters', since blank ballots just count as spoiled: always have, always will, so you can strike that bit from the accusation.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:31 pm

May's got 50%

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:32 pm

Corbyn sent an e-mail to me. He asked me and other Labour people to stay together. Simple, clear message I agree with entirely.
There is problem and that problem is Tory government. Tory government work away at one purpose and that is to divide people
from each other in order to keep resources for a few. I refuse to turn on people I have more in common with than I have differences.

yahyah · Post by **yahyah** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:33 pm

May 165
Leadsom 66
Gove 48
Crabb 34
Fox 16

frog222 · Post by **frog222** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:39 pm

ohsocynical wrote:Was Andrea Leadsom really such a City hotshot?

Andrea Leadsom has made much of her “25 years in Financial services” before the she became an MP. She is being widely described as “a banker”. Last week Bernard Jenkin MP endorsed her, citing her senior position at “a large investment firm where she was responsible for managing hundreds of people and billions of pounds”. In her interview with the BBC’s Andrew Marr on Sunday, she claimed during those 25 years to have “run enormous teams, small teams, start-up businesses”.

The problem about these claims is that they risk misleading people into believing that she has finance management skills and experience which qualify her for senior posts in government.

http://reaction.life/was-andrea-leadsom ... y-hotshot/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

When she expresses views on market and currency movements, as she did last week (notably seeming not to understand that the FTSE100 is denominated in Sterling, so that even today a Dollar investor in that index is looking at a loss of more than 10% since June 23rd), she is not speaking with the authority of experience.

At Perpetual/Invesco Perpetual she did not manage any teams, large or small, and she certainly did not manage any funds.

Keep them coming !!

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:39 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... left-power" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
After submitting this column, I jumped on a train to attend a mass meeting in London. The topic? Building a post-Brexit alliance. It brings together senior figures from the Lib Dems, the Greens, the SNP and, yes, Labour. Did hope die on 24 June? Or was it perhaps reborn?

Not a fan of Montbiot (understatement) but agree with him on this one

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:41 pm

Michael Rosen
‏@MichaelRosenYes

Story emerging that Corbyn eats noodles, covered on News programmes this morning. How low can he sink?

What! No bacon sandwich? Shameful

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:50 pm

New Shadow Cabinet

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:52 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 20271.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
story about a country that isn't monumentally stupid, or morally bankrupt

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:55 pm

Burnham, Abrahams & Rayner a powerful and talented group there I reckon.

HindleA · Post by **HindleA** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 6:58 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I fought for junior doctors’ rights – but the government destroyed their trust
Johann Malawana

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:10 pm

Abrahams against IDS and Rayner against Morgan are I think outstanding choices.

I just hope they get the chance to oppose them amidst all this mess.

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:17 pm

Michael Gove’s EU Tweet Prompts Hilarious Insults From Twitter Users

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/m ... 366f0faf62

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:21 pm

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... eu-options" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
We are entwined with Europe on matters of security, trade, migration, health and many many other issues besides – so much so that a PhD thesis could barely cover the pros and cons of membership. I was therefore dismayed when my government outsourced such a major decision to the public, who, despite many turning into vocal political orators on the subject, know very little indeed about the connotations.

indeed
I do feel that there is a criminal negligence issue here

But then I used to be an optimist

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:23 pm

Nigel Farage Resigns As Ukip Leader, Twitter Chimes In

“Farage stepping down to spend more time with his family, who are gutted to hear the news.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/n ... =uk-comedy

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:26 pm

ohsocynical wrote:
Michael Gove’s EU Tweet Prompts Hilarious Insults From Twitter Users

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/m ... 366f0faf62

Thanks Ohso. Deeply appreicated. I particularly enjoyed:

We had one of those you haunted pork mannequin.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:50 pm

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/686 ... esponsible" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Boris Johnson and Nigel Farage are "destroyers led by vanity", the European Union's (EU) foreign affairs chief warned.

apologies for link to Express

Post by **refitman** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:55 pm

Here is Ken, for those who haven't seen it yet (me).

[youtube]o5DgIa0VXkk[/youtube]
" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 7:55 pm

Evening to all

Just to add something on the Freaker's Ball that is the Tory leadership election

Firstly, it is funny how the Tories can appoint the PM with not a snigger from the press....compared to Brown back in the day. The difference also was that the the electorate knew in 2005 that Brown was going to take over....not something the 2015 electorate knew when they voted

The point I really wanted to make though was Leadsom....it looks like May will meet her in the head to head, although do not be surprised if May starts moving the votes to prevent this

And the reason is Boris!

If May meets either Crabb or Gove she knows that she will win. Leadsom is a bit different though. She was Brexit and she also has Boris behind her. If Boris can get out an about with the membership then he may swing a lot of votes her way....he is improbably popular with the membership.

It is still likely to be May but Leadsom may sneak in - the Tory membership are an odd bunch

It would also be interesting to see how the electorate find a pretty much unknown ex-banker as PM after a Tory-only choice....can't see that going down well - especially as she seems to be pretty rubbish

Interesting times!

Also, seems like Corbyn has survived until Chilcott - and the coup seems to be losing a bit of steam.....

Finally, economy realing creaking. Interested to see that there seems to be a common belief that a collapsing pound is good for an economy in the position the UK's is in - strange really

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:14 pm

So, Fox came last and now...

George Eaton ‏@georgeeaton 8s8 seconds ago
Stephen Crabb drops out having made smartest policy proposal: £100bn infrastructure investment fund.

And Then There Were Three.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:15 pm

European academic bodies are pulling back from research collaboration with UK academics, amid post-Brexit uncertainty about the future of UK higher education.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-uk- ... u-36719923" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:15 pm

If this is true, there are a few people who are going to look a bit silly......

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... and-watson" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

howsillyofme1 · Post by **howsillyofme1** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:16 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:So, Fox came last and now...

George Eaton ‏@georgeeaton 8s8 seconds ago
Stephen Crabb drops out having made smartest policy proposal: £100bn infrastructure investment fund.

And Then There Were Three.

Will may manipulate it so she meets Gove?

If she does then is that anyway to choose a PM?

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:22 pm

howsillyofme1 wrote:Evening to all

Just to add something on the Freaker's Ball that is the Tory leadership election

Firstly, it is funny how the Tories can appoint the PM with not a snigger from the press....compared to Brown back in the day. The difference also was that the the electorate knew in 2005 that Brown was going to take over....not something the 2015 electorate knew when they voted

The point I really wanted to make though was Leadsom....it looks like May will meet her in the head to head, although do not be surprised if May starts moving the votes to prevent this

And the reason is Boris!

If May meets either Crabb or Gove she knows that she will win. Leadsom is a bit different though. She was Brexit and she also has Boris behind her. If Boris can get out an about with the membership then he may swing a lot of votes her way....he is improbably popular with the membership.

It is still likely to be May but Leadsom may sneak in - the Tory membership are an odd bunch

It would also be interesting to see how the electorate find a pretty much unknown ex-banker as PM after a Tory-only choice....can't see that going down well - especially as she seems to be pretty rubbish

Interesting times!

Also, seems like Corbyn has survived until Chilcott - and the coup seems to be losing a bit of steam.....

Finally, economy realing creaking. Interested to see that there seems to be a common belief that a collapsing pound is good for an economy in the position the UK's is in - strange really

It would never surprise me if Leadsom gets it. Doesn't know what she's doing so is very malleable. And big majority of Tory MPs are Brexit.

Vordy · Post by **Vordy** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:38 pm

Them and us,now its them.

Revealed: Jobcentre Workers Could Be Hit By the Same Benefit Sanctions They Impose.

http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/theyre-c ... -sanctions" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **PaulfromYorkshire** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:39 pm

Yeah there's a danger for May that she's the obvious stop Gove candidate.

Once he's gone....

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:50 pm

Well.

The Staggers ‏@TheStaggers 21m21 minutes ago
Crabb and Fox back Theresa May for Conservative leader: http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/st ... rship-race" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:50 pm

EXPOSED: Labour plotters bid to keep Corbynista off NEC seat

http://morningstaronline.co.uk/a-9404-M ... 3xw_jZdHIV

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 8:52 pm

Pauline Lane ‏@Antonineone1 · 7h7 hours ago

Unless I'm mistaken, Watson said talks with Unions was Corbyn's last chance
What does PLP do next?
Unions have not asked Corbyn to go.

Tizme1 · Post by **Tizme1** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:01 pm

Greetings all,

Apologies if this has already been linked to - I'm skim reading again to catch up.

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/07/05/fres ... exclusive/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ohsocynical · Post by **ohsocynical** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:04 pm

Post deleted. Old article.

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:11 pm

Worth following David Allen Green who is somewhat dismissive of Oliver Letwin's ability to cope with a Brexit plan...

https://twitter.com/DavidAllenGreen

David Allen Green
‏@DavidAllenGreen
Letwin says new Cabinet Office unit could prepare a “fine grained, multi-dimensional” options paper on Brexit.

They haven't got a clue.

Would be worth a

if t wasn't so important...

AnatolyKasparov · Post by **AnatolyKasparov** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:20 pm

So another (delayed) local council byelection roundup - five last week:

Vale of Glamorgan - Independent hold, continuing the pattern seen here in 2012 when the outgoing Independent (a former Plaid candidate) topped the poll in a ward that had safely returned two Tories in 2004 and 2008. In a highly fragmented field, the winning score was just 29% - but this was enough to see off the Tory candidate (who had lost here four years ago, and was no less a figure than the then council leader) who saw their share down by another 7%. Labour - who have polled decently here in previous elections without ever really threatening to win - were down by a similar amount, and a fraction ahead of a second Independent (a well-known anti-devolution activist who recieved informal UKIP support) Plaid the best of the also rans (they have polled better in the past) then the LibDems whose 1% would normally be wooden spoon worthy - but not when a candidate polls just *four* votes, as the unfortunate Pirate Party hopeful did here (fewer votes than nominations is always something of a - negative - achievement)

Mole Valley DC - LibDem gain from Tory with an increase of over 20%, getting comfortably over half the vote and a swing of over 14% since just this May when they narrowly beat the Tories (who also won here last year and 2014 breaking a run of LibDem domination - 2004 and 2006 were the only previous Tory triumphs in the last 15 years) In fact, the LibDems surge came pretty much equally from all parties - UKIP were a very close third here in 2014 but a highly distant one now with barely 10%, though they were still ahead of Labour who were once competitive here - though those days seem long past as they also dropped significantly from two months ago. Greens also down, their share halved to less than 2%.

Luton - Labour hold in a traditionally safe ward, though their share had a double figure drop since last year to almost exactly 40%. This may not be unconnected, however, to the circumstances of the by-election - the very youthful incumbent being forced to resign after deeply offensive anti-Semitic remarks by them on social media were uncovered. Greens took advantage to move into a good second after coming last of three on GE day, and then the other factor for Labour slippage - increased competition - comes into play as the LibDems scored a respectable 14% having not bothered a year ago, ahead of the Tories who dropped from 30% then to barely 10% now (to emphasise their decline, they ran Labour close in 2007 and were also competitive in 2003) Two other "new entrants", an Independent and finally UKIP, made up the numbers.

Bexley - Tory hold in a ward which split 2Tory/1UKIP in 2014 - whilst their own share went up a bit since then, they were run close not by UKIP but Labour - who achieved a double figure increase having not been close here since they won all three seats back in 2002 - only to lose them all to the Tories four years later in a result which reflected the wider Conservative landslide in this borough. Despite this part of London voting by close to 2 to 1 for Brexit (very much against the city wide trend) a week earlier UKIP saw a remarkable slump as they dropped by 16%, getting barely half of what they managed two years ago. LibDems - once competitive here but not bothering last time - chanced their arm and got less than 5%, though that was enough to beat the BNP who dropped more than half in what is one of the few remaining "hotspots" of activity for them. Greens last with just 2%.

Thanet DC - UKIP hold, thus ensuring they maintain a presence in this ward where they won both seats last year after they dropped one to Labour in a previous by-election in January. Prior to the "purple wave" locally last year this had been a safe Labour area (only a "localist" challenge in 2007 came vaguely close) and Labour were not just up modestly on last year but fractionally on the previous by-election - however, the UKIP vote held up much better than then (maybe due to the reduced electoral competition - multiple Independents and Greens stood earlier this year but sat it out now) thus ensuring they - narrowly - held on. Tories down a bit on both recent contests, but the LibDems 4.5% was actually significantly up on earlier this year and may have helped thwart Labour.

Three contests this week - with any luck I will get back to Friday evening reports this time

RogerOThornhill · Post by **RogerOThornhill** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:57 pm

Good grief...

cow2016
‏@shoutsatcows
Andrea Leadsom wants all websites submitted to the BBFC first. That's how the Internet works http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/voice ... censorship" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; …

https://twitter.com/shoutsatcows/status ... 4921472001

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:58 pm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/201 ... -planning/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Leave was an alliance between ultra-libertarian, free-market advocates who wanted to position the UK to take full advantage of globalisation and large swathes of the population who felt those trends had gone quite far enough already, thank you very much. One group saw the EU as a barrier to the rest of the world, the other saw it as the portal through which everything they disliked had poured. With Leave’s victory, that circle needs to be squared by someone.

On the one hand quite interesting, and on the other trying to pretend that the government who caused this isn't responsible for it.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 9:59 pm

Am getting SO CLOSE to swearing.

tinyclanger2 · Post by **tinyclanger2** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 10:01 pm

In the meantime we are all in the hands of Mark Carney, the Governor of the Bank of England and the last grown-up left in the UK.

Can't help but agree with that.

citizenJA · Post by **citizenJA** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 10:17 pm

tinyclanger2 wrote:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/201 ... -planning/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Leave was an alliance between ultra-libertarian, free-market advocates who wanted to position the UK to take full advantage of globalisation and large swathes of the population who felt those trends had gone quite far enough already, thank you very much. One group saw the EU as a barrier to the rest of the world, the other saw it as the portal through which everything they disliked had poured. With Leave’s victory, that circle needs to be squared by someone.
On the one hand quite interesting, and on the other trying to pretend that the government who caused this isn't responsible for it.

Come, come! Let's just say it's a little bit your fault and it's a little my fault and wait for it... here it is....get over it!

Tubby Isaacs · Post by **Tubby Isaacs** » Tue 05 Jul, 2016 11:02 pm

RogerOThornhill wrote:
Willow904 wrote:I follow this guy on Twitter, he writes a political blog and has appeared in the Independent and he doesn't seem keen on Andrea Leadsom. Not sure if the following is accurate (he's remembering a meeting from some years back) but it seems curiously consistent from this lot of Tories:

There was, as it happens, some parting chat on Europe. She told me leaving would be madness and that proper Brexit would be insane.
http://nicktyrone.com/need-experience-g ... e-leadsom/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I still think they're up to something. What does she mean by proper Brexit? Is there some other kind?
I expect it means "Proper Brexit for everyone else but protecting the City firms so they won't notice any difference."

The City is likely to be the first target of the 27, isn't it?

How does she think she's going to stop them?