FlyTheNest

Publication of Andrea Leadsom's CV prompts new questions about her career

Fresh queries arise over Tory leadership candidate’s seniority and responsibilities in several roles
(Guardian)

tinyclanger2 wrote:Morning Ms Favor

http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/07/for- ... e-british/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;Anti-immigrant feeling won it for Leave, and they know it. They used it, rode it and are complicit in it. I’ve been dismayed to see people I’ve respected descend to this. I never thought either that the reserves of xenophobia in England were so strong, nor that people who should know better would play upon them with such careless cynicism. I was doubly naive.

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/mi ... s-11571861" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Gisela Stuart (Lab Birmingham Edgbaston) warned that politicians and the pro-EU media must accept that the public chose to leave - and stop imagining voters were either tricked into it or were motivated by racism.

https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/po ... ried-about" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
If Leave campaigners are worried about immigrants' rights, they should look at themselves
It wasn't Theresa May who put the rights of EU citizens at risk: it was the people campaigning to pull Britain out of Europe.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/st ... dum-brexit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
4 ways the anti-immigration vote won the referendum for Brexit
Total control on immigration mattered more to voters than the single market.

http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/we-asked ... ationships" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- My grandmum's Jamaican and she thought voting leave would stop the migrants coming and magically fix my granddad's visa issues so he could come home.
- My mum's always voted Conservative, but the fact that she's an immigrant from Pakistan and wanted to vote leave really surprised me, because – without making my mum sound like a horrible person – how can you deny people the rights you were given 20, 30-odd years ago?
- The UK always felt more adventurous and outward looking than central Europe. Now it just seems lame and parochial. I can't even play the, "yeah, but London is the coolest city ever" card anymore. Thanks Nigel and Boris, you dicks.

The idea that this action would become a recruiting sergeant for others to come to the colours of those who are “anti” any nation in the west is, I am afraid, nonsense. The biggest recruiting sergeant of all has been indecision, and the failure to take action to show that such resolve matters.

TobyLatimer wrote:Iain Duncan Smith, as Tory leader 2003 supporting the decision to go into Iraq

The idea that this action would become a recruiting sergeant for others to come to the colours of those who are “anti” any nation in the west is, I am afraid, nonsense. The biggest recruiting sergeant of all has been indecision, and the failure to take action to show that such resolve matters.

http://www.ukpol.co.uk/2016/01/18/iain- ... t-on-iraq/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Uncovering the smoking cannon: can anyone be held accountable for untruths told and overspending during the EU Referendum campaign?

"tinybgoat" https://waitingfortax.com/2016/07/07/re ... rspending/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

tinyclanger's scratched record productions wrote: http://theconversation.com/what-brexit- ... alth-61941" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Before the poll, the uniform message from the other leaders of the 53-member association had been a desire for Britain to remain a member of the EU. To the Commonwealth, Britain was a powerful and privileged member within the EU trading bloc, with considerable opportunities for diplomatic leverage in broader Commonwealth interests.

PorFavor wrote:

Publication of Andrea Leadsom's CV prompts new questions about her career

Fresh queries arise over Tory leadership candidate’s seniority and responsibilities in several roles
(Guardian)

No wonder she's such a hit with Iain Smith.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... out-career

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

StephenDolan wrote:Morning all.

Ouch. Some pretty scathing criticism in there.

MPs reject new head of Ofsted - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-36723828" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

yahyah wrote:Diane Abbott, on Today, could have phrased this better ''Jeremy doesn't believe in the politics of personal destruction, he leaves that to other people.''

Will await PorFavor's opinion. To me it is ambiguous.

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

55DegreesNorth wrote:

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

I know a lot of kids who have gone into the army & navy, including a lot of relations (my nephew was killed in Iraq). They join up because it's seen as a secure job & a way of getting a training, when nothing else is on offer for them. I think you're being a bit simplistic here.

Contrary to popular belief, 52% of people who voted Leave in the EU referendum lived in the southern half of England, and 59% were in the middle classes, while the proportion of Leave voters in the lowest two social classes was just 24%. Almost all other European countries tax more effectively, spend more on health, and do not tolerate our degree of economic inequality. To distract us from these national failings, we have been encouraged to blame immigration and the EU. That lie will now be exposed.

Most people younger than 50 who voted, voted to remain. But rather than blame the older generation, their ire should instead be directed squarely at all the post 1979 UK governments that have allowed economic inequalities to rise so high; that prevented a fair proportional voting system being introduced; that have harmed people of all ages; and that have placed future generations in peril.

AnatolyKasparov wrote:The most revealing remark from that anonymous Labour MP quoted in this morning's Telegraph is "they keep signing up members"......

Who, exactly, is "they"?

tinyclanger2 wrote:

tinyclanger's scratched record productions wrote: http://theconversation.com/what-brexit- ... alth-61941" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Before the poll, the uniform message from the other leaders of the 53-member association had been a desire for Britain to remain a member of the EU. To the Commonwealth, Britain was a powerful and privileged member within the EU trading bloc, with considerable opportunities for diplomatic leverage in broader Commonwealth interests.

55DegreesNorth wrote:

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

I know a lot of kids who have gone into the army & navy, including a lot of relations (my nephew was killed in Iraq). They join up because it's seen as a secure job & a way of getting a training, when nothing else is on offer for them. I think you're being a bit simplistic here.

Lost Soul wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... a-unveiled

It's an Ark... Noah's Ark ( repro )

The Ark Encounter, based on proportions laid out in the Bible, is 510ft long, seven stories tall, and features model animals – including dinosaurs...


wait, what... dinosaurs ?

Willow904 wrote:

55DegreesNorth wrote:

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

I know a lot of kids who have gone into the army & navy, including a lot of relations (my nephew was killed in Iraq). They join up because it's seen as a secure job & a way of getting a training, when nothing else is on offer for them. I think you're being a bit simplistic here.

I'm sorry to hear your nephew was one of the soldiers who died. That loved ones die in wars is why we wish no one would sign up to fight in the first place, but life is more complicated than that, isn't it? History is full of wars, even the most simplistic of hunter gather societies will clash from time to time over scarce resources. I'm not particularly inclined to let Tony Blair off the hook, but I would like to see a few more of the protagonists upon that hook with him, to be honest. The whole sorry saga of Saddam Hussein goes back to Thatcher and Reagan, the Iran-Iraq war, arms-to-Iraq, then Bush Sr and Major and the first gulf war, promises to Shia and Kurds to finish Hussein backtracked on by a President's desire for a clinical war - all this tragedy happened long before Blair was even elected but all contributed to the current state of affairs. Not to mention Bush Jr and Rumsfeld, who surely should take a large share of the blame. The obsession with Blair seems out of proportion in the context of decades of disastrous meddling in the Middle East by a succession of US and UK premiers.

It seems to me tge focus on Blair is convenient, politically, to those who seek to keep Labour out of power and sometimes I feel his role has been over-emphasised by some for cynical rather than genuine reasons. So the suffering of bereaved families is revisited over and over as the anger is kept alive. Personally I feel the least we can do for our armed services is to honour what they do by holding on to a sense that it was worth it, that they did a good thing, that Hussein was a monster who murdered many of his own people and deserved to be deposed. It's a type of truth, after all, and the one I prefer. I don't really know what good it does to persist in finding a "truth" in which it was all a complete mistake and nothing good came of it at all.

A little more focus on the lack of the right equipment and other mistakes made militarily and how to avoid these errors in future would serve a better purpose to help protect soldiers in future, I think, than trying to prove Blair is some kind of criminal.

Willow904 wrote:Btw - Andrea Leadsom - I know personal insults are childish and generally unacceptable but, bloody hell, she sounds thick. I mean, seriously?!

ephemerid wrote:

55DegreesNorth wrote:

yahyah wrote:Blair has a lot on his conscience.
But why is their no criticism of the soldiers who sign up to kill ?
Without them there would be no war.
The willing recruits who buy the macho myth about 'our heroes', and sign up, are the ones who fire the weapons.

I know a lot of kids who have gone into the army & navy, including a lot of relations (my nephew was killed in Iraq). They join up because it's seen as a secure job & a way of getting a training, when nothing else is on offer for them. I think you're being a bit simplistic here.

Yes.

Some people simply want to serve.

My daughter had already had a university education and worked for 3 years in the film/TV industry - but she also wanted to, as she put it, "give something back". So she followed her grandad's example and joined the RAF.

People who sign up for the Armed Forces know that they may be asked to go to a theatre of war; they know that they may be killed or injured if they do - and they know that they may have to kill or injure others.

In the case of Iraq, they followed the orders they were given, as all military personnel are required to do. I happen to know quite a few military and ex-military who did not think that this war was the right thing to do.

The issue is not the serving personnel who followed orders - the issue is that the orders should never have been issued.

We are commemorating the Somme and all those who fell. Another instance of an unnecessary war, political arrogance, and a badly managed campaign with no exit plan and a senseless loss of life.

We have learned nothing.

it looked as if Andrea Leadsom was the overwhelming favourite to come second today - meaning that Gove would drop out, and Leadsom and Theresa May would be on the shortlist of two in the ballot of party members. It was very hard to see where Gove would find the votes to catch her up. But after that speech I’m not so sure - because that speech was so dire that it would be surprising if some of her MP supporters who watched it did not start having second thoughts.

AnatolyKasparov wrote:The most revealing remark from that anonymous Labour MP quoted in this morning's Telegraph is "they keep signing up members"......

Who, exactly, is "they"?

Willow904 wrote:Btw - Andrea Leadsom - I know personal insults are childish and generally unacceptable but, bloody hell, she sounds thick. I mean, seriously?!