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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 8:21 pm 
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HindleA wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/19/even-in-power-politicians-often-powerless


Even in power, politicians are all too often powerless
Steve Richards
Quote:
"Voters ache for a more active state. Although they are anti-politics, they want governments to be more powerful. But there are limits to the power the outsiders can wield, as those who win elections discover. They cannot escape the constraints of democratic rule. We need to understand more about the powerlessness of power or fuming disillusionment will deepen further and dangerously."
Absurd
I don't listen or watch Richards and don't associate him with anything wrong or right but his article is ridiculous
There's nothing stopping responsible leadership but the determined resolution of god-awful inadequate Tory government remaining in power and to hell with people and country.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 8:47 pm 
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Quote:
Ex-legal chief attacks Theresa May’s ‘foolish’ claim on European court of justice
Doubts cast over Brexit red line as cabinet prepares to reveal more of its thinking this week
(Guardian)


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/19/brexit-european-court-of-justice-theresa-may-foolish-attack


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 8:56 pm 
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Four local council byelections this week:

Forest Heath DC - Tory hold with almost exactly half the vote, though there was a swing to Labour (at least using the "average" vote method) in a ward which returned three Tories in 2015 but had split 2Con/1Lab in 2011, 1Con/2Ind in 2007 and 2Con/1Ind in 2003. UKIP had stood in all those elections, always polling respectably and becoming very competitive towards the end in notably fragmented contests; they beat 2 of the 3 Labour candidates two years ago - but their absence this time round meant both the "big two" boosted their shares significantly. Greens stood for the first time, and polled a not derisory 9%.

Aylesbury Vale DC - two vacancies here; the first in a largely "new" ward created in the boundary changes for the 2015 elections saw a Tory hold after the division split 2UKIP/1Con two years ago. Their winning share now was still fairly modest, a shade under 35% (still up around 5 points since last time) but this time their main challenge was from the LibDems who took the Bucks CC division here in May (from UKIP) and now ran things close after a double figure increase. Labour were up 4 points to 24% in a respectable third place, whilst UKIP crashed from top place to just 5% and 4th now - at least they finished ahead of the Greens who did not stand previously. The other contest saw a LibDem hold in a ward that had only minor changes for the last elections, and where they have generally come out on top though not overwhelmingly so in recent years - they comfortably took both seats in 2003 and 2007 but dropped a seat to Labour in 2011; they regained it in a previous 2014 byelection only for Labour to win it back two years ago in a very even contest where Tories and UKIP were also strongly in contention. This time round the LibDems increased almost 10 points to 37%, their main challenge coming this time from the Tories who also significantly moved forward to over 30%, whilst Labour stayed fairly static and dropped to 3rd. Greens 4th with little change, just ahead of UKIP who slumped again - this time to only 4% and last place.

Peterborough - Labour hold with nearly 50% of the vote (up nearly 10 points since last year) thus seeing off the Tories when a gain for them would have seen them regain an overall majority on the council. This ward has been unchanged since the original 1997 elections for the unitary council when it returned three Tories and was always won by the blue team until 2010 - often by big majorities, for instance in 2008 they took around 70% and Labour were a poor third behind the Greens. All that changed in 2011 when Labour broke through to win, though the Tories held on in 2012, further Labour wins in 2014 and 2015 followed before the ward split 2Lab/1Con in all-out elections last year. There was a modest swing to Labour since then as the Tories also picked up slightly whilst the also-rans were duly squeezed - UKIP at 5% (nearly halved) then the LibDems and finally Greens at just 2% which meant they were down by over two thirds.

Another quiet period coming up - no contests next week and just two in the following one (on Tuesday and Thursday, unusually) to conclude August.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 9:01 pm 
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Thanks, as ever.

I saw the raw figures on Britain Elects. Without knowing anything about the local factors, I thought it looked like the Tories were doing better than they should be, seeing I can't recall them announcing anything popular since the election. Is this borne out?


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 9:08 pm 
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Tories are still dining off the collapse of UKIP to some degree, even in May 2016 they polled significantly better than subsequently.

But *most* contests since the GE are showing pro-Labour swings, in some cases markedly so.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 9:12 pm 
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Cheers. Labour seemed to be doing well enough. I hadn't picked up much coming from the Tories. Probably my bias. Still can't believe people haven't clocked that they're making it up as they go along.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 9:15 pm 
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... -influence

Quote:
Farewell to the ECJ? We may end up obeying laws but having no say in them


Crikey, if only experts had warned us about this?


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 9:27 pm 
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Tubby Isaacs wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/19/ecj-farewell-brexit-european-union-surrendering-influence

Quote:
Farewell to the ECJ? We may end up obeying laws but having no say in them


Crikey, if only experts had warned us about this?


Issue of the night on the graun's web homepage, this and the piece PorFavor links above. There's a good quote below the line on one of them...

Quote:
So I guess there's no pain without pain. And no gain at all.

_________________
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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 9:34 pm 
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Tubby Isaacs wrote:
Cheers. Labour seemed to be doing well enough. I hadn't picked up much coming from the Tories. Probably my bias. Still can't believe people haven't clocked that they're making it up as they go along.


It will be interesting when vacancies from this year's elections (very good for the Tories, bad for Labour, UKIP basically wiped out) start cropping up in number.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 10:25 pm 
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Quote:
Donald J. Trump ✔ @realDonaldTrump
I want to applaud the many protestors in Boston who are speaking out against bigotry and hate. Our country will soon come together as one!


Quote:
Donald J. Trump‏Verified account
@realDonaldTrump
Looks like many anti-police agitators in Boston. Police are looking tough and smart! Thank you.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 10:38 pm 
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goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 10:59 pm 
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http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/po ... s-11018228


Police probe deaths of 12 residents at eight nursing homes run by the SAME firm


http://www.sussexhealthcare.org/policy-group.html


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:22 pm 
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In context of Governmental concerted push to incarceration via economic means,removal of all inccome housing support for homeowners,increase in charges,restricting eligibility,slashing home support ,default necessary room charging,extra costs per head need reduction,thankfully far lower than the coalition aimed and voted for but still far too low,building regulations that eased adaptions cast aside as red tape .........contd on pg92.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:23 pm 
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And the big news!

https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/sta ... 6452799488

Quote:
David Allen Green‏
@davidallengreen
Following
More
This.

"stepping up pressure" with news of two minor position papers in response to already published EU position papers.


Wow.

:roll:

_________________
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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:25 pm 
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Stayed up 'specially.

Your team won again,I noticed. :D


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:33 pm 
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Am I missing something or have the Mail not run the "pressure" non-story at all?

Even with Geordie Grieg in charge (who doesn't support Brexit), that's quite a humiliation.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:36 pm 
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Can't see the Telegraph are bothering with it either.


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:42 pm 
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That UK paper on "continuity in the availability of goods" is going to say "Don't disrupt trade, it's in none of our interests", isn't it?

The EU will say "It's not us who wanted to tear up the old arrangements".


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PostPosted: Sat 19 Aug, 2017 11:45 pm 
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https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/ ... -part-time


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 2:10 am 
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 02461.html
David Davis:
Quote:
“In the coming days we will demonstrate our thinking even further, with five new papers – all part of our work to drive the talks forward, and make sure we can show beyond doubt that we have made sufficient progress on withdrawal issues by October so that we can move on to discuss our future relationship.


in the comments, by 'mourning the uk'
Quote:
So the Government's Brexit plan is simply to issue papers - that are as informative (but less useful) as torn off sheets of Andrex.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 9:58 am 
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Good morning all.

Mass lie-in, then?? ;)


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 10:05 am 
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Good morfternoon.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 10:33 am 
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http://www.the-gazette.co.uk/news/15474 ... ref=twtrec


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 10:36 am 
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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 10:43 am 
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https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... us-a-break


There are now more than 1,000 tax relief schemes. Give us a break
Phillip Inman


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 11:03 am 
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OOA figures highlight lack of mental health resources
(Scotland)


https://www.bma.org.uk/news/2017/august ... mgdoctors=

(Out of Area)


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 11:12 am 
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https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... ddle-class


Robots will not lead to fewer jobs – but the hollowing out the middle class
Larry Elliott


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 12:00 pm 
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PorFavor wrote:


http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?id=7201

Quote:
This is Donald Trump's favorite song of all time. On tapes released by the
New York Times , which contain interviews by journalist Michael D'Antonio for his 2014 biography The Truth About Trump , the billionaire explained:
"It's a great song. Because I've had these tremendous successes and then I'm off to the next one, because, it's like, 'Oh, is that all there is?' That's a great song actually. That's a very interesting song, especially sang by her, because she had such a troubled life."


(Suspect this may be one of those things everyone else already knows, except for me.)


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 12:03 pm 
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https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... es-aged-84


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 12:10 pm 
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https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... are_btn_tw


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 12:14 pm 
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http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/th ... lj?ocid=st



Thousands of pupils to receive 'incorrect' grades on GCSE results day


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 12:54 pm 
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Quote:
Brexit: Davis urges Brussels rethink on trade and withdrawal talks at same time

Brexit secretary argues talks so far prove it is impossible to settle withdrawal issues with no sense of future UK-EU ties (Guardian)


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/20/brexit-davis-urges-brussels-rethink-on-holding-withdrawal-and-trade-talks-at-same-time


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 1:02 pm 
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HindleA wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/aug/20/rail-fare-rise-force-key-workers-to-quit-public-sector-part-time

jack-ass economic system & enabling governmental leadership fails people and country some more


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 1:03 pm 
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Good-afternoon, everyone


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 1:09 pm 
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Interesting on price fixing and subsidising rail.

I agree with this

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/new ... 95196.html

Basically, I agree. We should stop price fixing and stop subsidising rail.

And not with this, the counter case

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/rai ... 03001.html


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 1:44 pm 
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Good afternoon

Excuse me if I think that a price of £120 for a one-way second class from Bracknell to Huddersfield (and one colleague was charger £240 for 1st) is daylight robbery - as an aside I have never understood why single ticket buyers subsidise return tickets?

British train fares are a scandal, especially if you aren't able to book in advance

Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 2:45 pm 
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howsillyofme1 wrote:
Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system


But there's no way *we* could do that, of course not ;)


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 2:56 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:
Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system


But there's no way *we* could do that, of course not ;)



No it seems not

Apparently the answer is to put the prices up even more


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:09 pm 
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howsillyofme1 wrote:
Good afternoon

Excuse me if I think that a price of £120 for a one-way second class from Bracknell to Huddersfield (and one colleague was charger £240 for 1st) is daylight robbery - as an aside I have never understood why single ticket buyers subsidise return tickets?

British train fares are a scandal, especially if you aren't able to book in advance

Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system
I like that, it's something I wish we had here in the UK. We lack political will, there's no lack of funds. The inefficient transportation systems some wealthy countries put up with are a bad choice. Individually, we're limited by our surrounding infrastructure and choices made by leadership.

edited to add
the way I wrote that sounds like I'm trying to evade individual free will and I'm not, that's not true. Mr citizen and I pay a price for not owning a motor vehicle. It's not a choice everyone can or will make. I'm mindful of the challenges we face.


Last edited by citizenJA on Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:19 pm 
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citizenJA wrote:
HindleA wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/aug/20/rail-fare-rise-force-key-workers-to-quit-public-sector-part-time

jack-ass economic system & enabling governmental leadership fails people and country some more
Sorry for not making myself clearer. Having done the maths, people realise their wages aren't enough to pay for transportation costs.
We live in a country capable of providing comprehensive and affordable public transportation for everyone. Crazy stupid leadership failure


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:21 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:
Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system

But there's no way *we* could do that, of course not ;)

bad government is the reason we don't have nice things


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:22 pm 
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Think there is at least one regular on here who is a Huddersfield Town fan? They must be pretty content right now.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:26 pm 
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AK

I think, if I we are talking of the same person, he actually supports Leeds despite being a native of Huddersfield - a brave decision to have made

Of course, he may now be reconsidering his allegiance!


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:30 pm 
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citizenJA wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:
Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system

But there's no way *we* could do that, of course not ;)

bad government is the reason we don't have nice things


It's not in this case. It's the government not subsidizing ticket prices. It chooses to subsidize investment instead, and its been very successful on its own terms of getting money into rail and expanding the number of trains running and the passenger numbers. The downside has been that old rolling stock has had to be kept going longer than necessary. But there's a very good ongoing programme for new stuff:

Image

The downside is tickets are expensive especially when you have to buy at short notice. I'd happily pay more tax to reduce that.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:35 pm 
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AnatolyKasparov wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:
Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system


But there's no way *we* could do that, of course not ;)



Of course we could.

If you want those who don't do the travelling to pay through taxation for those that do.

That isn't fair IMO. But we could reduce all the fares to 10p if we wanted to.

The one thing there is not is a free lunch.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:36 pm 
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I travel on the trains frequently in the UK and have seen no indications of many improvements over the years

Trans-Pennine is still slow and crap trains, almost always standing room only. Virgin trains the West Coast still smell of shit and the seats are atrocious.

Dirty trains with not enough space and eye-watering prices are my experience - but then jam tomorrow

Still doesn't explain why I paid £120 for a single train journey on a crap, cramped and dirty train - my colleague had a nicer experience in 1st Class but his ticket was £240


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:37 pm 
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Pricing should be done on the commercial basis airlines operate on. Rail has moved towards that, but there are still too many regulated parts of the system preventing that (eg the 'off-peak' cliff edge).


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:38 pm 
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Citizen, could be some good news for Stoke coming. I don't properly understand it but it could get HS2 trains if the new Crewe Station is built in a certain way. It seems that trains to stoke would go Euston, Old Oak Common, Stafford, Stoke, Macclesfield. That would be very quick.


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:38 pm 
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SpinningHugo wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:
howsillyofme1 wrote:
Fortunately, I live in a country where the prices are reasonable, very few peak fares and an integrated transport system


But there's no way *we* could do that, of course not ;)



Of course we could.

If you want those who don't do the travelling to pay through taxation for those that do.

That isn't fair IMO. But we could reduce all the fares to 10p if we wanted to.

The one thing there is not is a free lunch.



I find this 'who don't do the travelling to pay through taxation for those that do' argument nauseating to be honest

If we start looking at the funding of society being transactional then we become a very unpleasant and petty place - this is Thatcherite thinking at its most appalling


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PostPosted: Sun 20 Aug, 2017 3:40 pm 
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Tubby Isaacs wrote:
Citizen, could be some good news for Stoke coming. I don't properly understand it but it could get HS2 trains if the new Crewe Station is built in a certain way. It seems that trains to stoke would go Euston, Old Oak Common, Stafford, Stoke, Macclesfield. That would be very quick.


and how about Wolverhampton?

We pick up the scraps from Stafford......


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