Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

A home from home
Forum rules
Welcome to FTN. New posters are welcome to join the conversation. You can follow us on Twitter @FlythenestHaven You are responsible for the content you post. This is a public forum. Treat it as if you are speaking in a crowded room. Site admin and Moderators are volunteers who will respond as quickly as they are able to when made aware of any complaints. Please do not post copyrighted material without the original authors permission.
User avatar
refitman
Site Admin
Posts: 7692
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 7:22 pm
Location: Wombwell, United Kingdom

Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by refitman »

Morning all.
tinybgoat
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2231
Joined: Mon 23 Feb, 2015 8:23 am

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by tinybgoat »

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 47566.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Tory MP requests George Osborne is banned from party conference over Theresa May 'fridge murder' comments"
(Nadine Dorries)
edit to add, Good Morning.
Last edited by tinybgoat on Sat 16 Sep, 2017 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
tinybgoat
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2231
Joined: Mon 23 Feb, 2015 8:23 am

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by tinybgoat »

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -after-all" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Boris Johnson has insisted that Britain will still claw back £350m a week after leaving the EU, with much of that money preferably being spent on the NHS, as he warned critics of Brexit against treating 17.4 million voters as fools.
ironic,

also China Ummana, calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'
User avatar
RogerOThornhill
Prime Minister
Posts: 11115
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 10:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by RogerOThornhill »

Morning all. 'Er is not yet back indoors - looking like Monday.
Tim Stanley‏Verified account @timothy_stanley 13h13 hours ago
More
Charles Moore asks: "Is it time to place our future in Boris's hands and prepare for new leadership?"
No, no it isn't. And never will be.

Have they all gone mad at the DT?
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
User avatar
Willow904
Prime Minister
Posts: 7220
Joined: Thu 18 Sep, 2014 2:40 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by Willow904 »

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/i-worked-do ... young/amp/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I worked in Downing Street and this is how the Tories can help the young
I found this interesting. Did Theresa May really believe that spreading austerity to the older generation would win younger voters? Like, "I'm in huge student debt and will never be able to afford a house and the Tories aren't going to change this, but they're going to take my gran's bus pass away so it feels much fairer now so I'll vote for them after all." :roll:
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
SpinningHugo
Prime Minister
Posts: 4211
Joined: Mon 16 Feb, 2015 1:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by SpinningHugo »

tinybgoat wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -after-all
Boris Johnson has insisted that Britain will still claw back £350m a week after leaving the EU, with much of that money preferably being spent on the NHS, as he warned critics of Brexit against treating 17.4 million voters as fools.
ironic,

also China Ummana, calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'

Chukka's attempt to brand himself as the champion of Remain is ridiculous.

He voted for art 50 without conditions. He is one of the guilty.
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

As with so many "militant remainers", you sound ever more like a hard leftist two decades ago.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

Good-morning, everyone
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

Good morfternoon.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

tinybgoat wrote:---
[Chuka Umunna] calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'
(cJA edit)
:lol:
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

There's something you all should know
I like Chuka Umunna
It's a personal liking, he reminds me of a friend I knew a long time ago
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

tinybgoat wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -after-all
Boris Johnson has insisted that Britain will still claw back £350m a week after leaving the EU, with much of that money preferably being spent on the NHS, as he warned critics of Brexit against treating 17.4 million voters as fools.
ironic,

also China Ummana, calls ' for a “period of silence” from the foreign secretary.'
From the linked article -
He [Boris Johnson] said Britain would “keep environmental and social protections that are fair and wise”, but get rid of other EU regulations that, he claimed, cost between 4% and 7% of GDP.
Those words ("fair and wise") are not ones which come readily to mind when thinking of Boris Johnson. However, Theresa May might pinch this latest word-coupling to use on her Italian visit . . .
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.
Mr citizen was good enough to make your tea
he's handed me coffee with cream/milk
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

Willow904 wrote:https://inews.co.uk/opinion/i-worked-do ... young/amp/
I worked in Downing Street and this is how the Tories can help the young
I found this interesting. Did Theresa May really believe that spreading austerity to the older generation would win younger voters? Like, "I'm in huge student debt and will never be able to afford a house and the Tories aren't going to change this, but they're going to take my gran's bus pass away so it feels much fairer now so I'll vote for them after all." :roll:
I was perplexed by this bit from your linked article -
Universities are better funded and more accountable than ever before. (my emphasis)
User avatar
adam
First Secretary of State
Posts: 3210
Joined: Wed 27 Aug, 2014 9:15 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by adam »

PorFavor wrote:I was perplexed by this bit from your linked article -
Universities are better funded and more accountable than ever before. (my emphasis)
Because they've turned students into customers who demand value for money? (I haven't read the article yet).
I still believe in a town called Hope
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

@adam

Well, I can only assume that that's what's implied (although I don't believe it to be so) - no explanation is put forward.


Edited to add -

That is to say, I don't believe that universities are more accountable.
User avatar
Willow904
Prime Minister
Posts: 7220
Joined: Thu 18 Sep, 2014 2:40 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by Willow904 »

adam wrote:
PorFavor wrote:I was perplexed by this bit from your linked article -
Universities are better funded and more accountable than ever before. (my emphasis)
Because they've turned students into customers who demand value for money? (I haven't read the article yet).
Yeah, I think that's their argument. But before the introduction of fees unis were mostly dependent on central government for their money who have a lot more clout to demand changes if they didn't feel they are getting value for money than individual "consumers"/ students do, so that's really not the case, is it.
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

BBC referring to Johnson's "£350 million" claim as "controversial". Of course its nothing of the sort, it is and always was an outright fib.

When did they and other media outlets become infected with the idea that their obligation to provide "balanced" coverage meant being "balanced" between truth and falsehood?
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

T May attempted some justification for choosing Florence for her 22 September speech.
Asked why the venue had been picked, May’s spokesman said the prime minister...“The UK has had deep cultural
and economic ties spanning centuries with Florence, a city known for its historical trading power.


- Theresa May to deliver Brexit speech in Florence - Peter Walker, Guardian
For centuries, Britain's historical continental alliances don't typically include Florence but with other nations/regions in economic competition and military conflict against Italian regions.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

AnatolyKasparov wrote:BBC referring to Johnson's "£350 million" claim as "controversial". Of course its nothing of the sort, it is and always was an outright fib.

When did they and other media outlets become infected with the idea that their obligation to provide "balanced" coverage meant being "balanced" between truth and falsehood?
'Let's just say it's a little bit your fault and a little bit my fault' and therefore no one is held accountable for egregious wrongdoing.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

Individual students as education consumers don't have the power to force change
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

It's like expecting individuals to choose sustainable transportation, energy and food choice infrastructure through economic means
What we can't do on our own is a lot
If government declines to represent for the good of people and country, they need to go away and let someone else do it
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

Hodgson off to a good start at Palace, I see......
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
User avatar
adam
First Secretary of State
Posts: 3210
Joined: Wed 27 Aug, 2014 9:15 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by adam »

Willow904 wrote:Yeah, I think that's their argument. But before the introduction of fees unis were mostly dependent on central government for their money who have a lot more clout to demand changes if they didn't feel they are getting value for money than individual "consumers"/ students do, so that's really not the case, is it.
& @ PF - I agree, it does nothing of the sort but I can only imagine that's the argument. Willow your point is very good and thoroughly sensible but it goes against the religion of the market and the power of consumer choice so I doubt the government will be very interested.
I still believe in a town called Hope
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

JeSuisJuggalo?
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

AnatolyKasparov wrote:JeSuisJuggalo?
Stop clowning around.
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

AnatolyKasparov wrote:JeSuisJuggalo?
Apologies, AnatolyKasparov, please let me know what you're specifically referring to posting this if you've time
It's my ignorance, not your fault
PorFavor responded with something funnier than hell, I know that for certain
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

Its an (anti-Trump and alt-right) clown march on today.
Last edited by AnatolyKasparov on Sat 16 Sep, 2017 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

citizenJA wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:JeSuisJuggalo?
Apologies, AnatolyKasparov, please let me know what you're specifically referring to posting this if you've time
It's my ignorance, not your fault
PorFavor responded with something funnier than hell, I know that for certain
I assumed (rightly or wrongly) that AnatolyKasparov was referring to this -
No laughing matter: clowns brace for impact of Stephen King's It (Guardian)
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/s ... lown-craze
User avatar
refitman
Site Admin
Posts: 7692
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 7:22 pm
Location: Wombwell, United Kingdom

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by refitman »

AnatolyKasparov wrote:Its an (anti-Trump and alt-right) clown march on today
I feel sorry for the couple getting married in the middle of it all.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... washington" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

Ah...thank you, everyone, I understand now
I decline to know Trump
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

refitman wrote:
AnatolyKasparov wrote:Its an (anti-Trump and alt-right) clown march on today
I feel sorry for the couple getting married in the middle of it all.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... washington" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
'ignore him, Honey...'
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

@PorFavor
Scary image
Read the book years ago
it's just about right
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

From yesterday -
Head of scandal-hit G4S detention centres is put on administrative leave

The head of two G4S-run detention centres has been placed on administrative leave after a series of scandals, the Guardian has learned.

The news is another unfortunate milestone in a difficult period for G4S, which has faced severe criticism over its management of the two IRCs in the UK. (Guardian - my emphasis)
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... tive-leave
User avatar
RogerOThornhill
Prime Minister
Posts: 11115
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 10:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by RogerOThornhill »

PorFavor wrote:From yesterday -
Head of scandal-hit G4S detention centres is put on administrative leave

The head of two G4S-run detention centres has been placed on administrative leave after a series of scandals, the Guardian has learned.

The news is another unfortunate milestone in a difficult period for G4S, which has faced severe criticism over its management of the two IRCs in the UK. (Guardian - my emphasis)
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... tive-leave
Administrative leave?

Too wet for gardening I guess...
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

Pity the poor Brum fan who actually got a Harry Redknapp tattoo :lol:
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
User avatar
citizenJA
Prime Minister
Posts: 20648
Joined: Thu 11 Sep, 2014 12:22 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by citizenJA »

goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

citizenJA wrote:goodnight, everyone
love,
cJA
Night night, citizenJA.
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

Night night.
User avatar
refitman
Site Admin
Posts: 7692
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 7:22 pm
Location: Wombwell, United Kingdom

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by refitman »

Yay! Civil war!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ous-tories" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
User avatar
refitman
Site Admin
Posts: 7692
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 7:22 pm
Location: Wombwell, United Kingdom

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by refitman »

I see someone let Nick Cohen out again.
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

refitman wrote:I see someone let Nick Cohen out again.
To recycle almost the exact same column for the 137th time.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
tinybgoat
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2231
Joined: Mon 23 Feb, 2015 8:23 am

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by tinybgoat »

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... rears-soar" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"Revealed: universal credit sends rent arrears soaring"
Ministers are coming under intense pressure to put the brakes on the government’s flagship welfare reform programme, following damning new evidence that it is leaving thousands of low-paid workers unable to pay their rent and at risk of homelessness.
tinybgoat
Speaker of the House
Posts: 2231
Joined: Mon 23 Feb, 2015 8:23 am

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by tinybgoat »

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... -on-thames" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
‘You have one minute to get out’ police tell Sunbury residents
Actually about police raid for bombing suspect,
but read it after universal credit article & (in my mind, at least) headlines linked.
AnatolyKasparov
Prime Minister
Posts: 15626
Joined: Mon 25 Aug, 2014 9:26 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by AnatolyKasparov »

LibDem conference begins today - just how excited are we all??
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
HindleA
Prime Minister
Posts: 27400
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:40 am
Location: Three quarters way to hell

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by HindleA »

https://www.libdems.org.uk/autumn_conference_17" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.libdems.org.uk/autumn_conference_17_agenda" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

refitman wrote:Yay! Civil war!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ous-tories" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
If Boris Johnson is "tempting" Theresa May to sack him, could that not indicate that he feels that being sacked would work to his advantage? Or is his main aim simply to highlight her weakness?
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

Good morfternoon.
gilsey
Prime Minister
Posts: 6174
Joined: Thu 28 Aug, 2014 10:51 am

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by gilsey »

tinybgoat wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... rears-soar
"Revealed: universal credit sends rent arrears soaring"
Ministers are coming under intense pressure to put the brakes on the government’s flagship welfare reform programme, following damning new evidence that it is leaving thousands of low-paid workers unable to pay their rent and at risk of homelessness.
I think I got this from twitter, but if it was here, apologies.
http://data.parliament.uk/writteneviden ... 48055.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Written evidence from Professor John Seddon
There were and are two hurdles to success via the current design. Of these, the first is difficult, the second is insurmountable.

The first: UC relies on a large-scale computer system. 90% of large-scale computer systems fail, 30% fail completely, 60% run wildly over budget, don’t work as anticipated, requiring work-arounds or limiting functionality (Gauld and Goldfinch 2006). If UC ever gets over this hurdle – successive reports have shown significant problems with the IT – it will not get over the second.

The second: computer systems cannot deal with high-variety demand. This is because computer systems rely on rules. The consequence is always more demand (what I call ‘failure demand’) into call centres or face-to-face services. UC claimants epitomise high variety. Private-sector organisations whose leaders have been persuaded that digital will be cheaper quickly rein back from the strategy when they see the way costs rise. They, unlike the public sector, have the rudder of profit.
One world, like it or not - John Martyn
PorFavor
Prime Minister
Posts: 15167
Joined: Tue 26 Aug, 2014 12:18 pm

Re: Saturday 16th & Sunday 17th September 2017

Post by PorFavor »

Where's everyone gone? All rushed off to the LibDem Conference?
Locked