Tuesday 20th November 2018
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Welcome to FTN. New posters are welcome to join the conversation. You can follow us on Twitter @FlythenestHaven You are responsible for the content you post. This is a public forum. Treat it as if you are speaking in a crowded room. Site admin and Moderators are volunteers who will respond as quickly as they are able to when made aware of any complaints. Please do not post copyrighted material without the original authors permission.
Tuesday 20th November 2018
Morning all.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
https://www.parliament.uk/business/comm ... nch-17-19/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Inquiry launched on effectiveness of welfare system
Inquiry launched on effectiveness of welfare system
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
DM's change of tack --
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 9de3ff1721" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Rather lively BTL
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 9de3ff1721" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Rather lively BTL
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... new-report" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Charities risk becoming irrelevant, warns new report
Charities risk becoming irrelevant, warns new report
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
I liked this: " There is no business plan, and no targets, no outcome measures, no big marketing pushes."HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... new-report
Charities risk becoming irrelevant, warns new report
Some charities have become businesses like any other, except that there are no dividends to pay out to shareholders. The real objective is secure well-paid jobs and perks for the management , as in for-profit companies . One example of the scale of that: https://www.thirdsector.co.uk/former-ch ... le/1497308" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Good BTL ...
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Wren-Lewis on the UN report, highlighting something I hadn't seen reported before, although it's pretty much what we here think.
https://mainlymacro.blogspot.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://mainlymacro.blogspot.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I assume this is the 'political language' Rudd was complaining about.the policies put in place since 2010 are usually discussed under the rubric of austerity. But this framing leads the inquiry in the wrong direction. In the area of poverty-related policy, the evidence points to the conclusion that the driving force has not been economic but rather a commitment to achieving radical social re-engineering.
One world, like it or not - John Martyn
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
But exactly as they themselves frame it.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Morning all.
So the news today...
The price of shares in JRM fell dramatically overnight
Republicans will call for Ivanka Trump to be locked up. No?
And the DUP turn out to be exactly what people always thought they were
So the news today...
The price of shares in JRM fell dramatically overnight
Republicans will call for Ivanka Trump to be locked up. No?
And the DUP turn out to be exactly what people always thought they were
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
http://www.cpag.org.uk/content/un-rappo ... uk-poverty" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Pretty much sums it up...
Ian Dunt
Verified account
@IanDunt
17h17 hours ago
More
People who can't even organise a letter campaign insist complex international negotiation would've been fine if they were in charge
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
We've actually had quite a lot of information on the ideological campaign to shrink the state etc, when it's increasingly general knowledge that various thinktanks and other lobbying orgs are funded by extremist billionaires, such the Kochs and Mercers. But I agree with you that the level of knowledge of many voters is close to abysmal .gilsey wrote:Wren-Lewis on the UN report, highlighting something I hadn't seen reported before, although it's pretty much what we here think.https://mainlymacro.blogspot.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;I assume this is the 'political language' Rudd was complaining about.the policies put in place since 2010 are usually discussed under the rubric of austerity. But this framing leads the inquiry in the wrong direction. In the area of poverty-related policy, the evidence points to the conclusion that the driving force has not been economic but rather a commitment to achieving radical social re-engineering.
Polly's of this morning is all about the revolutionary ideology of the Trusses and Raabs et al -
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... no-deal-eu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Good stuff!
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
But of course discussing 'ideology' is not British
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
One thing about the DUP is that they say what they mean and mean what they say.RogerOThornhill wrote: And the DUP turn out to be exactly what people always thought they were
Even before last night, it was obvious May would be unwise to think she could fob them off.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Good-afternoon, everyone
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
JRM is apparently "urging patience" now.
Well as the saying goes, everything comes to those who wait - even if infirmity may preclude their enjoying it to the full
Well as the saying goes, everything comes to those who wait - even if infirmity may preclude their enjoying it to the full
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Good morfternoon.
Nadine Dorries on BBC's Politics Live:
". . .not reaching the 48 letter threshold is a tactical decision".
Nadine Dorries on BBC's Politics Live:
". . .not reaching the 48 letter threshold is a tactical decision".
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
PorFavor wrote:Good morfternoon.
Nadine Dorries on BBC's Politics Live:
". . .not reaching the 48 letter threshold is a tactical decision".
Yes, of course it is dear...
If I'm not here, then I'll be in the library. Or the other library.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
She is genuinely denser than plutonium
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Robert Halfon (BBC Politics Live, again) is now up to "4 priorities" (all of them different). General stuff - not "Brexit".
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Rees-Mogg getting desperate:
(From the G)Basically, if there is a vote of confidence it is not just for a year. Getting the 48 letters has shown to be quite difficult, so the idea that in a year you just repeat the process and then she would go at that point I don’t think that is realistic.
I think it is now or the prime minister will lead the Conservatives into the next election.
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Jacob Rees Mogg has a good track record on recognising "realistic", it should be pointed out.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
https://righttoparticipate.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Great comment on Twitter with respect to "queue jumping".
Mrs May you cannot "unblow" a dog whistle.
Mrs May you cannot "unblow" a dog whistle.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
https://www.parliament.uk/business/comm ... nce-17-19/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Cabinet Office not providing full information on voter ID inquiry
Cabinet Office not providing full information on voter ID inquiry
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
'let me be realistic'PorFavor wrote:Jacob Rees Mogg has a good track record on recognising "realistic", it should be pointed out.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... nazis-1939" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
"...just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions."
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
" After their escape, Attlee invited one of the children into their home in Stanmore, north London, testimony and letters show. He neither publicised nor sought to make political capital from his visitor."HindleA wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... nazis-1939
His SpAds must have been asleep
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
The House voting down May's withdrawal agreement makes Tory government's position untenable and a GE called
The DUP and Tory MPs likely agree that'd be the end of their leadership
They'll not let it happen
Is this about right or no?
The DUP and Tory MPs likely agree that'd be the end of their leadership
They'll not let it happen
Is this about right or no?
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
I don't think the DUP are in the same position as the Tories.citizenJA wrote:The House voting down May's withdrawal agreement makes Tory government's position untenable and a GE called
The DUP and Tory MPs likely agree that'd be the end of their leadership
They'll not let it happen
Is this about right or no?
They can easily go back to their supporters with heads held high. TBF They've played a blinder. Got the extra dosh for NI and stood up for the Union too.
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Will the DUP do something that'd give Labour a chance for government soon?
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
What do Tory/DUP MPs fear more
Voting for May's withdrawal agreement or voting against it making current Tory leadership untenable?
Am I mistaken thinking voting down the agreement leads to current government's downfall?
Voting for May's withdrawal agreement or voting against it making current Tory leadership untenable?
Am I mistaken thinking voting down the agreement leads to current government's downfall?
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
IMHO MPs worry mainly about their own seats.citizenJA wrote:What do Tory/DUP MPs fear more
Voting for May's withdrawal agreement or voting against it making current Tory leadership untenable?
Am I mistaken thinking voting down the agreement leads to current government's downfall?
The DUP won't want to be seen supporting a process that leads even slightly towards Irish unification.
Then it comes down to individual Tories and what they think their own electors will think. If they feel voters in their area will hate them for voting with May, they may prefer to bring down the government.
But in any case the Tories can continue just about as a minority government even if May's bill is voted down.
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Thank you, Paul
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
I think Tory MPs think of their party and will do nothing jeopardising their minority government
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
The DUP would have to start actively voting against them on motions of consequence in order to bring them down - ultimately would have to vote against a confidence motion (in the government, not a 1922 confidence motion on May) and risk a Corbyn and McDonnell government which it seems unlikely they would do - but you never know, and they are likely to decide what the see their principled line as being and then follow it.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:IMHO MPs worry mainly about their own seats.citizenJA wrote:What do Tory/DUP MPs fear more
Voting for May's withdrawal agreement or voting against it making current Tory leadership untenable?
Am I mistaken thinking voting down the agreement leads to current government's downfall?
The DUP won't want to be seen supporting a process that leads even slightly towards Irish unification.
Then it comes down to individual Tories and what they think their own electors will think. If they feel voters in their area will hate them for voting with May, they may prefer to bring down the government.
But in any case the Tories can continue just about as a minority government even if May's bill is voted down.
I still believe in a town called Hope
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
I think every Tory MP in the House will protect this government; they don't want an early GE even if it means years of dysfunctional government bad for people and country. There's no constitutional mechanism preventing this from happening. Major's Tory government limped along for years. The only reason May called the early GE was because she thought Tories would gain by it. The only 'will of the people' is their few friends and family profiting from their leadership.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
But, bizarrely, Corbyn is currently a much better guarantor of the Union than the Tories.adam wrote:The DUP would have to start actively voting against them on motions of consequence in order to bring them down - ultimately would have to vote against a confidence motion (in the government, not a 1922 confidence motion on May) and risk a Corbyn and McDonnell government which it seems unlikely they would do - but you never know, and they are likely to decide what the see their principled line as being and then follow it.PaulfromYorkshire wrote:IMHO MPs worry mainly about their own seats.citizenJA wrote:What do Tory/DUP MPs fear more
Voting for May's withdrawal agreement or voting against it making current Tory leadership untenable?
Am I mistaken thinking voting down the agreement leads to current government's downfall?
The DUP won't want to be seen supporting a process that leads even slightly towards Irish unification.
Then it comes down to individual Tories and what they think their own electors will think. If they feel voters in their area will hate them for voting with May, they may prefer to bring down the government.
But in any case the Tories can continue just about as a minority government even if May's bill is voted down.
As it is now plain to see, the best Unionist future is a Brexit within a customs union.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
I don't believe many Tories put their party's survival ahead of their own job!citizenJA wrote:I think Tory MPs think of their party and will do nothing jeopardising their minority government
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Sad news
Harry Leslie Smith@Harryslaststand
This is Harry Leslie Smith's son, John. Harry is in A & E and not in a good way. He asked me to inform you in case things don't work out. I will keep you posted.
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
During the EU referendum campaign the DUP spent £30k with obscure Canadian company Aggregate IQ. Also coincidentally used by official campaign Vote Leave and Farage's crew Leave.EU bankrolled by Banks.
Whatever "it" is, I would suggest the DUP are in "it" up to their necks.
Whatever "it" is, I would suggest the DUP are in "it" up to their necks.
"Fall seven times, get up eight" - Japanese proverb
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Nothing threatens their job except the next GEPaulfromYorkshire wrote:I don't believe many Tories put their party's survival ahead of their own job!citizenJA wrote:I think Tory MPs think of their party and will do nothing jeopardising their minority government
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
sending you and your family my love, JohnPaulfromYorkshire wrote:Sad newsHarry Leslie Smith@Harryslaststand
This is Harry Leslie Smith's son, John. Harry is in A & E and not in a good way. He asked me to inform you in case things don't work out. I will keep you posted.
cJA
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Off to the ECJ !
Brexit: court rejects attempt to derail article 50 hearing
Government challenge against European court of justice referral dismissed by supreme court
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... article-50" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Brexit: court rejects attempt to derail article 50 hearing
Government challenge against European court of justice referral dismissed by supreme court
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... article-50" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Well if you believe the cynics, the Twitter account should have no problems in continuing even if the worst happensPaulfromYorkshire wrote:Sad newsHarry Leslie Smith@Harryslaststand
This is Harry Leslie Smith's son, John. Harry is in A & E and not in a good way. He asked me to inform you in case things don't work out. I will keep you posted.
"IS TONTY BLAIR BEHIND THIS???!!!!111???!!!"
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
CRACE on the ERG
" Would you believe it? The European Research Group had significantly overestimated the number of people attending the launch of its new paper – why the UK should tell the EU to sod off: part 183 – and there were a few dozen empty seats by the time the event got under way at a converted church in Westminster. "
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -rees-mogg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
" Would you believe it? The European Research Group had significantly overestimated the number of people attending the launch of its new paper – why the UK should tell the EU to sod off: part 183 – and there were a few dozen empty seats by the time the event got under way at a converted church in Westminster. "
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -rees-mogg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Patience is a virtue. Virtue is a grace. Constance is a cat.
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Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
John McDonnell MP
@johnmcdonnellMP
Absolutely staggering. The Government has just accepted all Labour amendments to the Finance Bill because they couldn’t rely upon DUP to support them. Tories in office not in power. A government falling apart in front of us.
@johnmcdonnellMP
Absolutely staggering. The Government has just accepted all Labour amendments to the Finance Bill because they couldn’t rely upon DUP to support them. Tories in office not in power. A government falling apart in front of us.
Re: Tuesday 20th November 2018
Was there a "money back guarantee" with that there arrangement? I mean they've already spent a good chunk of it. What did the small-print say?PaulfromYorkshire wrote:John McDonnell MP
@johnmcdonnellMP
Absolutely staggering. The Government has just accepted all Labour amendments to the Finance Bill because they couldn’t rely upon DUP to support them. Tories in office not in power. A government falling apart in front of us.
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